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Pacific Surfliner

Discussion related to Amtrak also known as the National Railroad Passenger Corp.

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Re: Pacific Surfliner

 #1623489  by HenryAlan
 
You could probably divert the line to the I-5 ROW as it approaches Capistrano Beach. That would put the route on an alignment not too far from the current ROW, but certainly far enough inland to avoid erosion issues. Might cost a lot more than just frequent repairs, though.

Re: Pacific Surfliner

 #1623515  by STrRedWolf
 
HenryAlan wrote: ↑Tue Jun 06, 2023 2:27 pm You could probably divert the line to the I-5 ROW as it approaches Capistrano Beach. That would put the route on an alignment not too far from the current ROW, but certainly far enough inland to avoid erosion issues. Might cost a lot more than just frequent repairs, though.
Frequent repairs are getting all the way up to costing as much combined as a new ROW, including costs to bus-subsitute. This is a *train* after all. It should have reliable infrastructure to run on, and that coastal line isn't reliable!

Re: Pacific Surfliner

 #1623550  by eolesen
 
Yeah, no. I spent a lot of time out that way. I-5 simply doesn't have room. Elevating isn't an option as freight also still moves on the line as well.

This line has run for over 100 years on the coast. Fixing it correctly will probably never happen because putting up retaining walls will destroy billions in property values between SJ Capistrano and San Onofre, so continuing to patch things up will be the most likely outcome.

Re: Pacific Surfliner

 #1623680  by BandA
 
Hopefully the Surfliner won't turn into the Landslider and derail into the ocean.

Re: Pacific Surfliner

 #1623706  by STrRedWolf
 
eolesen wrote: ↑Wed Jun 07, 2023 5:13 pm Yeah, no. I spent a lot of time out that way. I-5 simply doesn't have room. Elevating isn't an option as freight also still moves on the line as well.

This line has run for over 100 years on the coast. Fixing it correctly will probably never happen because putting up retaining walls will destroy billions in property values between SJ Capistrano and San Onofre, so continuing to patch things up will be the most likely outcome.
I-5's too close to the ocean anyway. Reroute that train to the I-15.
BandA wrote:Hopefully the Surfliner won't turn into the Landslider and derail into the ocean.
If it continues, it's going to take a Landslider to get any proper action.

Re: Pacific Surfliner

 #1623712  by eolesen
 
Moving Amtrak inland only benefits those going between LA and SD.

What is your plan for the commuter service that currently exists and travels over the line between Capistrano and Oceanside?

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Re: Pacific Surfliner

 #1623772  by STrRedWolf
 
eolesen wrote: ↑Sat Jun 10, 2023 1:37 pm Moving Amtrak inland only benefits those going between LA and SD.

What is your plan for the commuter service that currently exists and travels over the line between Capistrano and Oceanside?
Build new track between San Juan Capistrano and Oceanside on the inland side of Camp Pendelton, going down the San Luis Rey River side to reach Oceanside. Bus-subsitute San Clemente until a transit study can be done between the two points. I consider anything so close to the coast line that waves are eroding the track to be a lost cause.

Re: Pacific Surfliner

 #1623863  by eolesen
 
They're talking about the San Diego County portion only. From San Onofre south, the line is fairly secure and stable.

It's the 6 miles thru San Clemente and Capistrano Beach that are the nightmare, and almost all of it in Orange County.

Perhaps the I-5 routing isn't a bad idea... the beachfront real estate is too expensive but condemning a 50 ft strip along the I-5 and doing an Alemeda Corridor type project might be the right long term fix...



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Re: Pacific Surfliner

 #1623864  by Jeff Smith
 
https://ktla.com/news/california/orange ... mente/amp/
Orange County Transportation Authority declares emergency over threatened railroad track

The Orange County Transportation Authority has declared an emergency related to a sliding hillside in San Clemente that has threatened a railroad track and led to the intermittent halting of train service in parts of Southern California.

The OCTA Board declared the emergency Monday, just days after the land beneath the historic Casa Romantica cultural center began to slip away, sending dirt and rocks onto the train track below.

The emergency vote will allow OCTA CEO Darrell E. Johnson to take the necessary actions to “protect and reopen the track,” according to a release from the Board.

OCTA is working with Metrolink, the commuter rail system that serves Southern California, to develop a new plan and implement safety measures to protect the rail line, which is located beneath the cultural center just north of the San Clemente Pier.
...

Re: Pacific Surfliner

 #1623886  by HenryAlan
 
STrRedWolf wrote: ↑Sat Jun 10, 2023 11:47 am I-5's too close to the ocean anyway. Reroute that train to the I-15.
Absolutely not. The I-15 corridor serves a completely different region, so if that were to be done, essentially you'd be eliminating Amtrak from a region with 2.5 million people that are used to having the service.

As for this:
STrRedWolf wrote: ↑Sun Jun 11, 2023 1:33 pm Build new track between San Juan Capistrano and Oceanside on the inland side of Camp Pendelton, going down the San Luis Rey River side to reach Oceanside. Bus-subsitute San Clemente until a transit study can be done between the two points. I consider anything so close to the coast line that waves are eroding the track to be a lost cause.
That's not the area with the erosion problem, it's already more inland at that point. Furthermore, you'd need to cross a small mountain range in order to position the ROW east of Pendleton. The only solution that is going to work will be one that shores up the existing ROW, though I still maintain it could be placed in the I-5 ROW, perhaps on a viaduct.

Re: Pacific Surfliner

 #1623915  by west point
 
Jeff Smith wrote: ↑Tue Jun 13, 2023 3:51 am https://ktla.com/news/california/orange ... mente/amp/

The OCTA Board declared the emergency Monday, just days after the land beneath the historic Casa Romantica cultural center began to slip away, sending dirt and rocks onto the train track below.

The emergency vote will allow OCTA CEO Darrell E. Johnson to take the necessary actions to “protect and reopen the track,” according to a release from the Board.

OCTA is working with Metrolink, the commuter rail system that serves Southern California, to develop a new plan and implement safety measures to protect the rail line, which is located beneath the cultural center just north of the San Clemente Pier.
...

About time. Don't we love bureaucratic inertia> Now if the Governor will do same then SO CAL can get back to normal service in a year or so.

Re: Pacific Surfliner

 #1623922  by electricron
 
This is Amtrak’s second busiest passenger train corridor with Amtrak’s famed Northeast Corridor being the busiest of all. And Amtrak can not keep its trains running reliability on it? Imagine a significant part of the NEC, like the bridge over the Chesapeake Bay between Baltimore and Philadelphia. Would anyone plan to ride the train-bus-train replacement service for a rather long time?

Re: Pacific Surfliner

 #1623941  by STrRedWolf
 
electricron wrote: ↑Tue Jun 13, 2023 11:21 pm This is Amtrak’s second busiest passenger train corridor with Amtrak’s famed Northeast Corridor being the busiest of all. And Amtrak can not keep its trains running reliability on it? Imagine a significant part of the NEC, like the bridge over the Chesapeake Bay between Baltimore and Philadelphia. Would anyone plan to ride the train-bus-train replacement service for a rather long time?
Here's the thing: That's not Amtrak trackage.

That's OCTA down to San Clemente, followed by North County Transit District, then BNSF's San Diego Subdivision. BNSF says it's all theirs via the SCRA. I'm just going to say it's BNSF's trackage, not Amtrak's.

No matter what, though, Amtrak's a tenant on the trackage. They're beholden to the owner's management of the line, and if they can't run trains because it's OOS, there's nothing much they can do.

If Amtrak owned it, it would already be moved and we wouldn't have the conversation, now wouldn't we?

Re: Pacific Surfliner

 #1623951  by eolesen
 
The same Amtrak with literally billions of liability for old bridges and right away in the Northeast, and tunnels too?

Let's be clear, the recent problems in San Clemente are from above the tracks. That's not the railroads responsibility.

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