New Dinky to Nassau Street

What with BBD in the midst of being bought out by Alstom, it seems doubtful they're working on anything new for NJT at any rate of speed. And aren't the MLV EMUs NJT's idea anyhow?

Trying to shoehorn EMU guts into a MLV II is a fools mistake,design the Arrow IV instead.Stop the waste oF R&D funding.

Good morning folks,

Since I see this thread has recently been revived, I just wanted to pass along some information for those who might not have been aware. Rodney Fisk, a longtime resident of Princeton and fervent supporter of the Dinky, (and the "creator" of this very thread) passed away back on September 9, 2020. I only recently learned of his passing so I apologize for not sharing this in a more timely manner.

Rodney's National Interurban organization made headlines back in the 1980's and 1990's when he proposed to take over operation of the Dinky from NJT. His proposal called for using new DMU equipment and a European style operation. Despite his idea being mocked in certain circles, Rodney was actually able to advance his privatization effort further along than most thought would be possible. Unfortunately, the powers that be were not inclined to give his ideas a chance.

While Rodney's dream of seeing a for-profit Dinky never came to reality, his pioneering work did help to create an important legal and legislative mechanism which permitted a number of other new commuter start up operations to emerge. It was Rodney's work regarding general railway liability issues and the need for indemnifications for carriers that created the framework for the legislation which ultimately lead to the formation of the Virginia Railway Express (VRE) operations in Washington, DC. and others. This critical framework is now standard throughout the rail industry. However, back in the 1980's, it was unheard of until Rodney attempted to startup a "for profit", privately held commuter rail operation.

For those who actually knew Rodney and had the chance to work with him, I've provided a link to his obituary below. I figure it was only fitting to share this news in this thread since Rodney created it himself many years ago.

https://matherhodge.com/tribute/details ... tuary.html

Rest in peace good sir!

I am very sorry to hear that. Thank you for letting us know. Jim S

Matt Johnson wrote: ↑Sun Aug 09, 2020 7:28 pm How many Arrow IIIs does NJT have left? If there are enough cars to string together to cover the 2.5 miles or so along the Princeton branch, they could just have a stationary 2.5 mile long train where you board at one end, walk the length of the train, and disembark at the other end. Rail connection maintained, zero operational cost!

Hey Matt, wasn't your signature at one time about the Arrows on the NEC? Asking for a friend!

Jeff Smith wrote: ↑Fri Dec 11, 2020 11:59 am
Hey Matt, wasn't your signature at one time about the Arrows on the NEC? Asking for a friend!

Haha, that's right, now that I think about it!

Eric S Strohmeyer wrote: ↑Fri Nov 20, 2020 6:22 am Good morning folks,

Since I see this thread has recently been revived, I just wanted to pass along some information for those who might not have been aware. Rodney Fisk, a longtime resident of Princeton and fervent supporter of the Dinky, (and the "creator" of this very thread) passed away back on September 9, 2020. I only recently learned of his passing so I apologize for not sharing this in a more timely manner.

Very sorry to hear that, thanks for passing along the info.

A very recent article that mentions that the study for the future of the Princeton Branch is in full swing. https://planetprinceton.com/2021/04/08/ ... -underway/

There is a lot of good information here. I like how NJT is considering purchasing transit vehicles that can run on both rails and roads. Personally, I would like to see the Dinky remain rail, at least between both the present NJT Princeton Station and the Junction. It would be nice to have the vehicles run as a bus between Princeton Station and Downtown Princeton. This would reduce the amount of walking a person has to do between the downtown area and the present NJT Princeton Station. As for new stops along the branch, I think adding one in Penns Neck where the tracks go over Rt. 1 would be great, given the fact that there are loads of retail, dining, and lodging venues very close to there. Plus, bus routes that run up and down Rt. 1 between Plainsboro and Trenton can connect to the Princeton Branch transitway.

Official statement from Trains.com. Current options are current rail only, rail and bus, or bus/tram only. Interesting to see that an expansion to Downtown Princeton is being considered as well.

https://www.trains.com/trn/news-reviews ... ton-dinky/

— A no-built option that would continue the current service;

— A roadway with embedded rail that can support rail and rubber-tired transit vehicles;

— A standalone rail corridor with a parallel roadway for bus or rubber-tired tram service;

— A roadway with a guideway that could support a rubber-tied tram and buses.

Potential expansion of the service into downtown Princeton, and the addition of more stops, will also be part of the study. A final analysis and selection of a preferred alternative is due by the end of the year.

It really probably should be a light rail service of some kind at this point. Besides reopening the Penns Neck station, the concept of a light rail/tram might be a lot better served.

I'd like to think they might do something visionary that includes some sort of light rail. In reality, I have a hard time believing that they'll resist the temptation to just revert to the cheapest option, which is conventional bus service.

Any bus service the entire way between the Princeton Station and the Junction Depot, it should run on a dedicated right of way. By having these buses run their entire trip on roads shared with cars, that subjects then to extreme traffic connections which could result in passengers missing their trains on the mainline. It’s happened many times with passengers taking the current substitute buses. If NJT decides to extend the transit services to Downtown Princeton which they should, then the vehicles would have to operate on regular roads. The borough nor the university probably doesn’t want NJT to construct a dedicated right of way between Princeton Station and the downtown area.

Matt Johnson wrote: ↑Tue Apr 13, 2021 7:42 am I'd like to think they might do something visionary that includes some sort of light rail. In reality, I have a hard time believing that they'll resist the temptation to just revert to the cheapest option, which is conventional bus service.

Nobody has yet explained how bus service is allegedly cheaper (certainly never be faster or more comfortable) versus the FRA rail shuttle. Never mind light rail, which has proven way more expensive and also to have higher failure rates in the long run.

It's pretty self-evident no?

The current Arrows will not last forever. Maintaining them costs more and more $$$ every year.
The replacement will require running 3-car trains. Absolutely insane and wouldn't even fit on the current platform at Princeton Junction (not sure about the terminus).

Not sure where the statement that light rail is "way more expensive" is coming from. [citation needed]?

No the current Arrow IIIs won't last forever and truthfully, based on hearing the excessive feedback about them breaking down a lot for the last several years, they have been on their way out for a while. That is a good point about a three car Multilevel MU set not fitting the platform at Princeton Jct.