Moves in Downtown Wilkes-Barre last week and other questions

Pretty much every day last week (and possibly continuing this week, although I havent been around), there was a small dark blue switcher running back and forth over the line that runs right through Downtown Wilkes-Barre. Its the line that goes past Air Products in Hanover all the way through downtown past the old depot that used to be Market St Square (that I think Luzerne County just bought), and up past the Lion Brewery and beyond. I had never seen much movement on this line before except when they were moving out the old rail cars that had sat between Pennsylvania ave and Wilkes-Barre boulevard for all those years, although i have noticed in recent years that most of the grade crossings have been replaced with precast concrete sections (which are very nice to drive over). Im wondering who was responsible for the moves recently and who owns and still uses the line (I assume Air Products still does and there is a scrap yard across the street from them where I have seen railcars). Its a weird line as it passes almost exclusively through some of the most populated sections in the Wyoming Valley. I imagine it was very useful when there was still a station downtown, as well as when the old Vulcan Iron works was still going, but today it seems like it would be kind of a headache to use on any sort of regular basis, there have to be at least 20-25 grade crossings in about 3 or 4 miles, most of which dont even have lights, let alone gates. Anyone have any info?

mhig9000 wrote:Pretty much every day last week (and possibly continuing this week, although I havent been around), there was a small dark blue switcher running back and forth over the line that runs right through Downtown Wilkes-Barre. Its the line that goes past Air Products in Hanover all the way through downtown past the old depot that used to be Market St Square (that I think Luzerne County just bought), and up past the Lion Brewery and beyond. I had never seen much movement on this line before except when they were moving out the old rail cars that had sat between Pennsylvania ave and Wilkes-Barre boulevard for all those years, although i have noticed in recent years that most of the grade crossings have been replaced with precast concrete sections (which are very nice to drive over). Im wondering who was responsible for the moves recently and who owns and still uses the line (I assume Air Products still does and there is a scrap yard across the street from them where I have seen railcars). Its a weird line as it passes almost exclusively through some of the most populated sections in the Wyoming Valley. I imagine it was very useful when there was still a station downtown, as well as when the old Vulcan Iron works was still going, but today it seems like it would be kind of a headache to use on any sort of regular basis, there have to be at least 20-25 grade crossings in about 3 or 4 miles, most of which dont even have lights, let alone gates. Anyone have any info?

The tracks are used by the Luzerne & Susquehanna RR, which is owned by Luzerne County.

With the removal of most of the rails by either Conrail or Pocono Northeast, these and a few other remnants are the only tracks left in the area and is a hodge podge of many different former lines. At one time there was the RR infrastructure in place to avoid moving freight through Wilkes-Barre altogether, but sadly it is long gone.

These tracks may still have other life in the future though, as there are plans to revitalize passenger service from Wilkes-Barre to Scranton and beyond. At this point it only in the planning stages and there are some obstacles to overcome.

On the Railfan.net forums under Shortlines, there is a thread about the L&S. It's chock full 'o' info.

The line from Air Products to the Vulcan Iron Works is former PRR. The line it connects to near Pennsylvania Boulevard is part of the former LV and CNJ mainlines which side by side in that area. Past the former Market Street Square complex the trackage is a combination of former LV and D&H. Prior to Conrail, Air Products would ship HUGE heat exchangers that would be picked up by Penn Central and moved about three miles to the Lehigh Valley, moved another two miles or so, handed off to the D&H, taken by the D&H to Dupont and handed back to the Valley for transport to Oak Island and the Port of Newark.

At one time in the area in question there were four class one railroads and two interurban lines all operating within less than a linear mile.

Thanks guys, you answered most of my questions already. Its good to hear that rail transport is alive and well in the Wyoming Valley.

Just one more question, does CP run through freights over the L and S on the Kingston secondary? Ive heard long freights running over the "Black Diamond" (as we used to call it when we were kids) trestle that crosses the susquehanna just off Riverside drive in South Wilkes-Barre.

The line that CP runs over is separate from the L&S. That was given to the D&H with Conrail and they run down to Sunbury and up to Binghamton through Kingston. They interchange with the L&S at the site of Hudson Yard (not much left to speak of).

The line that CP runs over is the former Wilkes-Barre Connecting Railroad which was owned 50/50 by the D&H and the PRR/PC. The WBCRR was used and is continued to be used as a freight bypass around the City of Wilkes-Barre and essentially ran the D&H's Hudson Yard to the PRR's Buttonwood Yards. On C-Day complete ownership of the line plus the former PRR Wilkes-Barre Branch/Secondary from Buttonwood to Sunbury was ceded to the D&H as part of plan to give Conrail some competition. The D&H used the line to run as far south as Potomac Yard.

Many of the freights you hear now are actually Norfolk Southern trains utilizing trackage rights. Sort of a "role reversal" if you will.

Much discussion on this line:

http://forums.railfan.net/forums.cgi?bo ... 1125759970

Very interesting stuff, so if the line that runs over the Black Diamond is the w-b connecting railway, what is the "Kingston Secondary" referenced here? I assumed that the w-b connecting railway was the Kingston secondary because it seems to converge with old PRR line near air products (which i assume is buttonwood yard, is there still an actual yard here btw?) as seen on the map near the bottom of this page(on a sidenote, has the red line on that map been pulled up?). Also, the L and S seems to use the lines that run behind the Huber breaker and into the Hanover Industrial park (I assume the breaker and the industrial park are on the same line?) Im guessing this is the old CNJ, so would that mean that it connects to or becomes the line that runs up into bear creek (the so-called "back track") that crosses lauren run road just after giants despair near the intersection with the connecting road to 309 (which i have heard referred to as "baby road)? Also, where does the Huber line connect to the rest of the L and S system? Thanks again guys, you've provided me with tons of great stuff.

The Kingston Secondary, if I were to hazard a geuss the Kingston Secondary would be the former DL&W Bloomsburg branch. The branch is severed in the area of Kingston and had been washed out for a few months (maybe longer) but is back in service. About three-four years ago there were numerous lease engines stored there. The Back Track is operated by the R&N. The trackage in the area of the Huber is severed. The grade crossing by the Huber is taken up but the signal mast remains.

The Kingston Secondary consists of both the former DL&W Bloomsburg Branch and the Lehigh Valley's West Pittston Branch which roughly paralleled each other from their respective crossings of the Susquehanna River in West Pittston to just south of Pringle Street in Kingston. Much of the former LV line was pulled up Conrail and Pocono Northeast with ramps constructed at a few points along the line to allow access to the LV remnants from the former Bloom.

For example, the LV line from north of Division Street to Eighth Street in West Wyoming was pulled up and a ramp was constucted near Division Street to allow access to a cluster of sidings in the area between Division and Pringle Streets in Kingston. This is in the area of the former Kingston Yard of the DL&W.

The only thing left of Buttonwood Yard are a few sidings that in the past were rented to a company that would bring in salt from mines in upstate New York for re-distribution to local towns for ice melting. Go to this link: http://www.gingerb.com/cnj_wilkes-barre_station.htm and scroll down to you see "The Pennsylvania Railroad in Wilkes-Barre" for more information. The rest of the www.gingerb.com site can provide lots of information for you as well.

metman499 wrote:The Back Track is operated by the R&N.

Actually, the CNJ backtrack from the Ashley Shops area to Northhampton St. in Laurel Run is long gone. At Laurel Run the LV Mountain cutoff joins the CNJ backtrack up the mountain into Penobscot yard which R&N operates today known as the Lehigh line.

The trackage in the area of the Huber is severed. The grade crossing by the Huber is taken up but the signal mast remains.

Just a note, the trackage in the area of the breaker which is used to serve the industrial park, roughly follows the old Ashley Planes main from Franklin Jct. out of Wilkes-Barre into the former Ashley shops area. It then crosses the severed mainline as it follows the former Nanticoke Branch route past the breaker into the industrial park. As far as I'm aware, the industrial park is the farthest west this line goes.

The CNJ mainline from Wilkes-Barre is severed at the bridge over Ashley street and where the industrial park trackage crosses it. Mainline trackage from where it is severed by the industrial park line towards Georgetown and Laurel Run has been removed. As matman says, the signal near the former mainstreet crossing still stands.

I live in downtown Wilkes-Barre now. I'm looking for any local railfans that would like to talk trains, chase trains, etc trains...I live in a high rise with a view of the westmost bridge over the Susquehanna, but I've never seen a train cross it. Do they all run at night? I have a scanner that picks up the detector west of downtown (MP 696.?) and it reports two or three trains between 6pm and midnight most nights. Still, I never see daylight movement on the main. Does it happen?

hebron_hapt wrote:I live in downtown Wilkes-Barre now. I'm looking for any local railfans that would like to talk trains, chase trains, etc trains...I live in a high rise with a view of the westmost bridge over the Susquehanna, but I've never seen a train cross it. Do they all run at night? I have a scanner that picks up the detector west of downtown (MP 696.?) and it reports two or three trains between 6pm and midnight most nights. Still, I never see daylight movement on the main. Does it happen?

There are a few of us who like to get out from time to time and check out the area. We do a lot of railroad archeology and when in the area of active track, sometimes catch some live action.

Most of us are more active on railfan.net than we are here, though we do check in from time to time.

JJP