Mechanicville Yard Aerial Report

@Ken:
If what you're saying about intermodal is true, than explain to me why all seven Class Is run unit trains of stacks and RO-ROs, and why these trains have a priority comparable to the Great Northern's Silk Trains of the 1920s. Even Amtrak trains are sidelined to let these Z trains pass.
Also: explain to me why Chicago — Boston [Ayer] via Mechanicville is not competitive. CSX's line is indeed faster by track speed, but it's less direct, and the clearances from Albany to Worcester also require touping/filleting at Selkirk. As for Mechanicville itself,

But what do I know? I'm just a 16 year old kid sitting in front of a computer speculating while you are clearly one who has experience both in the field and in the numerical realm.

Lastly:

By the early 1990's, the two largest U.S. trucking companies.......Schneider National and J.B. Hunt, began using rail for the longer haul portions of their traffic, which perhaps is a good testament in itself for Rail's share of Intermodal traffic. Nowadays, there is an increase with the use of domestic containers by rail instead of trailers.

Here is an interesting read on the current state of the trucking Industry......." Mama's Don't Let Your Babies Grow Up to be Truckers ".............

http://dcvelocity.com/articles/20111205 ... r_an_exit/

Mcoov wrote:@Ken:
If what you're saying about intermodal is true, than explain to me why all seven Class Is run unit trains of stacks and RO-ROs, and why these trains have a priority comparable to the Great Northern's Silk Trains of the 1920s. Even Amtrak trains are sidelined to let these Z trains pass.
Also: explain to me why Chicago — Boston [Ayer] via Mechanicville is not competitive. CSX's line is indeed faster by track speed, but it's less direct, and the clearances from Albany to Worcester also require touping/filleting at Selkirk. As for Mechanicville itself,

But what do I know? I'm just a 16 year old kid sitting in front of a computer speculating while you are clearly one who has experience both in the field and in the numerical realm.

Lastly:

(A) Pretty sure Chicago to Worcester via CSXT is more direct (i.e. shorter mileage) than NS-PAS Chicago to Ayer
(B) CSXT will be fully cleared for high cube double stacks to Worcester in a few months

Great find, red wing!

Blending Mr Patrick's comments in this forum and at the RTAC meeting, he seems to feel that intermodal isn't profitable enough because railroad prices are too high. (Which reminds me of the joke about no-one going to a restaurant anymore because it's too crowded.) And railroads are wrong for market-based pricing. And that states should take a more active role in the regulation of interstate commerce. (Thankfully the Board took exception to his opinions.)

Looks like what we have here, boys, is a disgruntled shipper.

Exactly. His first post on this forum was about getting screwed on a rate to ship outbound C&S out of Devins...

KEN PATRICK wrote:i love these blogs. they show an amazing lack of knowledge about railroad fixed/variable costs , pricing and management rewards. think of adding $40mil in fixed costs and $3-$4mil in variable costs/year because you don't want to increase the 10' roof cut an additional foot, use steel ties, and pandrol fasteners to get to 22'? it's a no-brainer. run the grinders thru a few times.
our state suffers from high transportation railroad pricing. it kills new business. as a member of the freight advisory panel i see presentations that cite the northern route without addressing this tunnel and pricing. it's foolish for mbta to spend anything on pas without extracting pricing concessations. also, the ns hype that they will spend $132mil and not fix the tunnel and two bridges is just silly. lastly, ns mechanicville to chicago is not competitive. they got the short end in the conrail break-up. ken patrick

The only poster who has shown "an amazing lack of knowledge" (or that a little knowledge can be a dangerous thing) is, unfortunately, you Mr. Patrick. Your thesis about intermodal shows a complete lack of understanding about railroad economics; your cost-plus pricing premise and argument that PAS should handle NECR/CN traffic to the P&W a lack of knowledge about railroad marketing; your promotion of how CSX should handle blocks of stone traffic into NYC a lack of understandng about railroad operations, your stubborn misunderstanding about the capital cost justification for Mechanicville a lack of understanding about railroad finance; and, your premise about what it will take to provide full clearance into Ayer a lack of understanding about railroad engineering.

To the point about how NS economically justified Mechanicville, though you have shown time and again an unwillingness to "get it", here are the likely benefits that supported the investment:

1. Cost savings of rent to CP for the intermodal terminal operation it replaced; 2. cost savings for the auto traffic handled by a shortline; 3. new traffic growth in the Chicago lane and future Crescent Corridor lane; 4. cost savings and cost avoidance of doublestacking the Ayer traffic between Mechanicville and Chicago; and, 5. likely operating savings of a modern terminal vs. the smaller terminal replaced.

The likely marginal analysis that NS faced in deciding filleting/toupeing in a mixed-use terminal vs. clearing the route into Ayer obviously lead them to the decision they made...with a payback exceeding 10 years by my estimation to have cleared into Ayer instead of laying out a PORTION of Mechanicville's capital costs for filleting/toupeing and adding additonal terminal handling costs, and with the likelihood that some sizable portion of the cost to clear into Ayer will be assumed with public funding within the 10 years. Sure seems like a no-brainer.

now that's a good summary in my opinion.

amazing. google my name and 'patents' . 'state to assume costs etc' the myopic mindset of kool-aid drinkers willing to spend tax dollars on railroad infrastructure without rate concessions. it isn't intermodal pricing that makes it marginal, it's having to chase trucking rates with expensive equipment and trains to stay alive. as for railroad experience , how about 5k waybilled carloads/year 1991-1997, patented intermodal system, dozens of proposals involving all east coast railroads.i've tracked more railcars than most of you have passed telephone poles. i was wrong about the freight committee. i was asked to join by a member but realized it was form-over-substance when i opined that spending tax dollars on mass railroads was foolish without rate concessions. such opinion ranked me as a nut with the 'cognoscenti'. why would anyone object to promoting 'freight villages' using rail paid-for by taxpayers without settling rail pricing? take a look at the projected rail freight delusion of the south coast rail proponents. take a look at the state rail plan. take a look at how stb settles rate disputes. i'm not a disgruntled shipper. i'm a proponent of the efficient use of railroads in our national transportation system. railroads have been good to me. ken patrick

KEN PATRICK wrote:google my name and 'patents' . 'state to assume costs etc' the myopic mindset of kool-aid drinkers willing to spend tax dollars on railroad infrastructure without rate concessions.

First off, that wasn't even a coherent sentence. What does drinking Kool-Aid have to do with anything?

it isn't intermodal pricing that makes it marginal, it's having to chase trucking rates with expensive equipment and trains to stay alive.

What "expensive equipment"? You seem to be stuck in the mindset that toupeing and filleting at Mechanicville are going to lead to the total and utter financial destruction of PAS, PAR, and NS (That's been my impression so far). May I remind you that all containers headed east of Mechanicville are loaded onto the bottom positions in Chicago, while all the top containers are for the Albany area. They could simply send the train right on through without loading the top containers if it was that uneconomical to stop in Mechanicville for a few hours.

such opinion ranked me as a nut with the 'cognoscenti'.

And here as well.

take a look at the projected rail freight delusion of the south coast rail proponents.

There's nothing to look at. The South Coast Rail is a commuter line.

"...the myopic mindset of kool-aid drinkers willing to spend tax dollars on railroad infrastructure without rate concessions..."

If I may put into other words: If the government provides any rail infrastructure subsidy/support, rates of the railroad beneficiary should be capped using cost-plus methodology... 1.8X VC to be precise.

Mr Patrick, the country's entire road infrastucture network is subsidized. I must assume then, that you are contending all intra- and interstate trucking rates immediately be regulated and capped using a similar VC multiplier methodology. If so, Seriously? If not, please reference earlier "disgruntled shipper" statement.

BTW, waybilling cars may make one an experienced shipper (then again, it may just make one an experienced clerk), but it doesn't make one a railroad financial/operations expert any more than a long-term rail employee becoming a garbage logistics expert by way of his/her road hauling MSW.

it's like writing for the blind. roads are public, railroads are private. railroads once has 90% of tonnage, now 12%. why? myriad of reasons, the premier being pricing. why do railroads think they must price at 'market'-whatever that means.why do railroads think taxpayers should cover their infrastructure deficiencies so they can make more money? why not attempt to be honest by pricing on costs and give-back to the taxpayers a mode that encourages job growth. i find it intellectually dishonest for railroads to bleat about how they suffer without massive public money while doing 10% + roa. remember every nth car is costless. car volume should be the goal, not margin per car by commodity. rationalize why coal moves at $1.00/mile/car while plastics move at $6.00/mile/car. if you try, then you really know nothing about railroad economics. and south coast has a projected freight benefit/cost ratio of 2.5x. does this pass the straight face test? ken patrick

Has your drinking water been tested? Are you really blaming the demise of rail as the dominate form of freight transportation primarily due to pricing?

It can really be summed up in a couple words: Eisenhower Interstate System.

The railroads could have delivered a boxcar for $5 or free, and they would have switched. A week or a few hours to get your product?.... do the math.

Folks, we're pretty far off-topic at this point. I don't want to stifle a spirited and interesting discussion, but some of the topics we've branched out into would probably be better located in the Pan Am Southern thread. Please keep this in mind going forward. Thanks.