Railroad Forums 

  • MEC/B&M Track Conditions 1981/1983

  • Discussion relating to the pre-1983 B&M and MEC railroads. For current operations, please see the Pan Am Railways Forum.
Discussion relating to the pre-1983 B&M and MEC railroads. For current operations, please see the Pan Am Railways Forum.

Moderator: MEC407

 #897685  by TomNelligan
 
I have never been a fan of the way the Guilford organization does business, but it is probably fair to say that everything they have done since their takeover of the MEC and B&M (including the reduction in maintenance, the abandonment of branchlines, and confrontations with organized labor) was done for the purpose of maximizing profit. One could argue with the strategy, and as one who was very familiar with the Alan Dustin-era B&M I do, but not necessarily with the motivation. For better or worse, that's how capitalism works.
 #897689  by jaymac
 
gokeefe-
Item 2- Greed, perhaps, but most likely not primarily for money. Perhaps, more, it was greed for control. A later examination follows.
Item 3- Inexperience? Hardly. Fink the Elder brought decades of PRR/PC experience to to Guilford. Unfortunately much of that experience focused on reducing service, not increasing it. Read or re-read the Fred W. Frailey article in "Trains" in which he discussed The Elder's earlier tenure as a division superintendent and his control of those underneath him. He, in turn, was controlled by equally demanding vice-presidents. As a principal in Guilford and one in whom the other principals held confidence, he emerged as someone who had no signicant check over how he wanted to run the enterprise. His reduction-of-services frame of reference got free rein. If problems did happen, think three disparate references -- John Wayne, Mel Brooks, and Shakespeare.
Approximate quotes:
"Never apologize. It's a sign of weakness." -John Wayne
"It's good to be the king." -Mel Brooks
There are too many potential Shakespeare possibilities, but just think how kings or princes --or principals -- get changed by their attempts to acquire and maintain power. A driven, driving, dominant, and dominating personality left unchecked can lead who knows where.
Somewhere in the previous paragraph is possibly a response to Item 1, as well.
 #897703  by MEC407
 
gokeefe wrote:I can't remember when they got in the airline business.
1998.

The railroad was already in terrible shape in 1998, and had been that way for quite some time, so I think it's fair to say that Guilford's acquisition of the remnants of Pan Am wasn't the reason that the railroad came to be in such bad shape. That happened long before the airline acquisition. Check out the Pentrex video Today's Maine Railroads, filmed in 1992; lots of nice footage of Guilford freights poking along at 10 MPH between Waterville and Rigby. (There's also some footage of East Deerfield to Rigby freights moving at a comparatively fast 25 on the "straightaway" in North Berwick, but that's still a far cry from 40.)

If it hadn't been for the Downeaster upgrade in 2000-2001, the Plaistow-Portland mainline would probably still be 10 MPH today. Ditto for the west end if the NS buy-in hadn't happened.
 #897967  by Cowford
 
To F-Line's reference to the Staggers Act, looking back at those days is not complete without considering the impact that deregulation had on GTI's decision-making. Industrial decline in New England was quickly accelerating in the early 80s and dereg of rail and truck markets was quickly taking hold, further changed the environment. Prior to dereg, ICC foot-dragging on line abandonments was legendary. This, along with onerous labor agreements, retarded the roads' efforts to right-size their systems to the changing environment. One of GTI's first acts was to aggressively shed unprofitable lines. In addition, the road sought to right-size its labor burden by aggressively seeking concessions, including the solution of leasing lines to Springfield Terminal and invoking the ST's more flexible labor agreement. (Keep in mind the system's prospects were looking up in the post-dereg world, but prosperity in the new environment demanded significant improvements in labor productivity.) Disputes over this, job protection on abandonment-related job eliminations, etc. led to the nasty 1986 strike. The unrest drove a harsh decline in business, etc.

The manner in how GTI went about adjusting their system to survive the changing landscape is open for debate, but two issues they confronted (an unproductive network and unrealistic labor restrictions) would had to have been faced by whomever was controlling those lines at the time.
 #898094  by BigLou80
 
eddiebehr wrote: Just before Amtrak established its Montrealer about 1972 or so, B & M got funds to do major tie and ballast work, Springfield-E Northfield and Brattleboro-Windsor. I was working in B & M Accounting and Property Records when these loans and grants were being awarded.
That must have been the last work done to that line,by 1987 Amtrak was no longer able to run the montrealer due to lousy track conditions. Im no expert on track conditions but I doubt it went from 40mph in 1983 to exempt by 1987
 #898099  by Dick H
 
Perhaps I missed prior references in this thread, but the sale of buildings
and land throughout the B&M and MEC systems brought in many millions
of dollars and continues to this day, although there is probably little real
estate left to sell. Some property they would like to sell has major haz-mat
issues, which a sale would cause a clean-up scenario. In some cases, there
has been property leased, rather than sold, to avoid major cleanup issues.

It seems doubtful that any appreciable amount of the proceeds from property
sales went back into the railroad, being track, locomotives or equipment and
facilities. There has been speculation that losses from the airline ownership
were covered at the expense of the railroad. Only Messers Mellon and Fink
know whether that was the case.
 #900201  by Tim Mullins
 
When I went to work for Guilford in 1997, after leaving Amtrak...don't ask me why, I remember running between New Gloucester (spelling?) east and CPF-185 at 40...MEC guys that I worked with said there were places where the speed was 50 and this was prior to the take over...Deffered maintenance is what it is and will end up costing you down the road...
Look at Readfield. That section was always terrible...Any business man, or woman, will tell you that time is money...In
Mr Frailey's article in Trains Magazine, Mr. Fink is quoted as saying that he was happy with 10-25 mph...You say decades
of experience with P/C? Does that explain what happened to it?
 #900271  by jaymac
 
There is a bifurcation of Finks (I've been waiting so long to type that phrase!): The Elder was PRR/PC while The Younger -- the one who I believe was quoted as saying in effect that 25 is fine and 10 is, too -- has taken over much of the day-to-day operations. The Elder spent much of his pre-Guilford career in collapsing already collapsing operations. He also spent a significant amount of his PC time at least witnessing the Red Team v. Green Team Wars of Survival, wars not for increasing a customer base or improving services, but wars between ex-Pennsy -- Red -- and ex-NYC --Green -- upper-level managers over who would keep their jobs.
 #900513  by Tim Mullins
 
Forgive me if I change the subject for a bit....I know we make alot of comments about the company,I know I'm guilty of it, but for the lack of a better way to vent...Anyone who has worked for the company can understand what it 's like to try and do the work the best and safest way you can only to be so frustrated and stressed out that one has to mark off sick...To be threatened and intimidated and in some cases go to a hearing for not taking equipment that was unsafe and had FRA defects or to haul a train up hill at 3 mph because the power was dead for some reason...Constant derailments and everything was our fault....Our fault because we are union people and the two hate each other..as history shows!
No one could quite understand that both side could work together for one common goal and that is to take care of the customer and the bills would be paid....Everone wants to make a living for themselves and their family...I'm sure alot of people out there can relate if you work for a compay that doesn't appreciate their employees...Thanks for letting me vent!
Now I will disappear....
 #909985  by gokeefe
 
Tim,

Sorry for the delay. I was 'busy' as it were. I can sympathize with feelings of helplessness and severe stress.

You have my deepest sympathies.

I remain hopeful that 'The Company' as it were continues to show signs of being more interested in their rail operations than they were ten or more years ago, especially when the airline was up and running.
 #925716  by spirithorse
 
From WhiteRiver Jct, VT to Berlin, NH was my territory. The track conditions were good, occasionally we would have 35 mile slow downs but for the most part speed was around 50 average.
 #926602  by gokeefe
 
spirithorse wrote:From WhiteRiver Jct, VT to Berlin, NH was my territory. The track conditions were good, occasionally we would have 35 mile slow downs but for the most part speed was around 50 average.
spirithorse,

Thanks for the post! Welcome to the forums!