Mail and Express and Grand Central

I am perplexed a little as to how mail and express was handled in and out of GCT. I know that the NYC handled it out of the Morgan Annex, close to their 30th St Branch. Solid M&E trains would go to Harmon and the headend cars were handled to/from the trains from GCT with the engine change.So the mail volume at GCT was modest.

As far as the NH is concerned, there was the large express facility in the Harlem River yard. But where would those cars be added to trains out of GCT? Was it at New Haven? I assume that the mail for the NH was loaded in GCT since the PO was right above the tracks.

On the loop track in GCT, there were hatches in the wall that would line up with the side doors of the headend cars through which mail was tossed and collected one floor down after the train unloaded passengers.

Norman

R,N, Nelson wrote:I am perplexed a little as to how mail and express was handled in and out of GCT. I know that the NYC handled it out of the Morgan Annex, close to their 30th St Branch. Solid M&E trains would go to Harmon and the headend cars were handled to/from the trains from GCT with the engine change.So the mail volume at GCT was modest.

As far as the NH is concerned, there was the large express facility in the Harlem River yard. But where would those cars be added to trains out of GCT? Was it at New Haven? I assume that the mail for the NH was loaded in GCT since the PO was right above the tracks.

On the loop track in GCT, there were hatches in the wall that would line up with the side doors of the headend cars through which mail was tossed and collected one floor down after the train unloaded passengers.

Norman

At least during my days and probably long before the New Haven did not handle Railway Express out of Grand Central Terminal to amount to anything. They handled a lot of mail which came down in to the track 14 area direct from the Grand Central Post Office on Lexington Avenue and 45th Street. New Haven had an Railway Express terminal at Harlem River which handled a lot of Railway Express for points east and north via the New Haven Railroad. Through cars of Railway Express came through Penn Station from various points on the PRR and were interchanged to the New Haven both on through trains and as pick ups as well. They also handled Railway Express out of a large Railway Express terminal at Sunnyside Yard. There may have been one train in and out of Grand Central Terminal which handled a very small amount of Railway Express but in looking at the train consist book for April, 1955 the Railway Express that headed east and north on the New Haven came out of either Harlem River, Penn Station or Sunnyside Yard. There were no facilities for handling mail or express on the loop tracks at Grand Central Terminal, they were absolutely need at all times for yard moves, to turn equipment and to turn engines. Incidentally the Railway Express cars out of Sunnyside Yard and Harlem River went to some really interesting and exotic destinations in New England such as: Chicago - Hartford, Chicago - Boston, Pittsburgh - New Haven, Jacksonville - New Haven, Jacksonville - Boston, Miami - Boston, greenville - Boston, Atlanta - Boston, Cincinnati - Boston, St. Louis - Boston, Harlem River - Danbury, Harlem River - Pittsfield, Harlem River - Waterbury, Harlem River - Portland, Harlem River - Bangor, Harlem River - Concord, Harlem River - White River Junction, Harlem River - Intervale (North Conway), Harlem River - Dover and of course cars to South Norwalk,Bridgeport, New Haven, Hartford, Springfield, New London, Providence, Worcester and Boston from all sorts of places. It was a big operation for the New Haven and we had plenty of trains of just mail and express mostly out of Penn Station, Sunnyside and Harlem River. We did handle quite a bit of US Mail in and out of Grand Central Terminal both in RPO's and in baggage cars (closed pouches) and we also handled a lot of newspapers mostly on Saturday nights as baggage and again it was good business for the railroad.
Noel Weaver

To add to my last post, some trains out of Grand Central Terminal which had baggage or mail cars on the head end were simply loaded off the departure track and they had lots of electric mail/express wagons to use for this purpose and a lot of employees to handle this work as well.
As for the express routed Harlem River to Danbury or Pittsfield, the cars were dropped by 198 at South Norwalk and picked up in the morning by train 140. For Waterbury and New Britain they were dropped by 198 at Bridgeport to be forwarded by train 442 to Waterbury, Winsted and New Britain. Many more went to New Haven and beyond either on 98 which ran to Springfield at one time or were switched to other trains to be forwarded beyond New Haven.
In addiltion even after McGinnis drove the Boston and Maine out of the passenger business we still forwarded cars of Railway Express by freight from Cedar Hill to Portland and these cars were moved from New Haven to Cedar Hill by a yard transfer and ran on train M-6 out of New Haven.
Noel Weaver

Thanks for the information. You have fully answered my questions and I'm sure those of others as well. I had forgotten about the large REA facility next to the Sunnyside yard.

So in other words, any trains in/out of the Harlem River yard were solid M&E trains and those cars were not necessary added to through trains in/out of GCT. Whereas, headend cars at Sunnyside could be added to the consist and moved into Penn Station to be added to a through train or could run as a solid train from the REA shed.

If the hatche(s) in the wall of the loop track at GCT and the chute(s) to the level below, which were on the south side of the loop, were not for mail, do you have any idea what they were they for? I seem to think there was only either one or two, maybe just one.

When I inspected this in the mid 1980s with a friend who worked in GCT, it was not in use, so we speculated it must have been for mail unloading at one time.

Norman

Railway Express at Harlem River was handled through the "Express Shed" which had four tracks and was owned by the New Haven but leased to Railway Express. Two trains worked here eastbound, 98 out of Sunnyside backed down into Harlem River from Oak Point (SS-4) and 198 was made up at Harlem River for New Haven and handled any local express cars for connections between New York and New Haven. Train 63 handled most of the westbound Railway Express traffc for Harlem River and it was usually a pretty good size train. On Saturday and Sunday when 63 did not operate sometimes they would run an extra to Harlem River but more likely the Harlem River cars would go out of New Haven on the rear of 187 or after the trains north of Springfield on the Boston and Maine were discontinued 169 (by this time 169 was mail and express with only one coach for passengers) and these cars would be dropped on the rear at SS-4 (Oak Point) where a switcher would take them to Harlem River and spot them in the shed. Incidentally in the later days of Harlem River operation the tracks in the shed were wired for electric motors but on the west end of the shed (toward St. Anns Avenue) the wire came out of the doors for a few car lengths so a yard switcher (diesel of course) would have to tie on to the motor, pull it west and shove it east to a point by the yard office where there was again good wire for it to operate back to the motor shop at Oak Point. Harlem River was a busy place at this time with three yard engines around the clock and most nights a yard job would come down from Oak Point during the wee hours to help out with the work, there was that much work there at the time.
As for the vents on the loop in Grand Central, I am not sure, I seem to recall them, maybe a vent from one of the concessions in the terminal.
Noel Weaver
Noel Weaver

Thanks for the additional info. It rounds out the picture.

The opening in the wall of the loop track was not a vent. It was about 5'x5" and when we looked down it, we saw a chute and the floor of the level below. There was nothing down there that I could see, just the concrete floor of a well lighted area..If you ever find out I'd like to know.

Norman

In addition to the mail and express, one mustn't forget the newspaper traffic. At one time it was considerable - New York City newspapers went far east of the city.

Statkowski wrote:In addition to the mail and express, one mustn't forget the newspaper traffic. At one time it was considerable - New York City newspapers went far east of the city.

Absolutely so, we had trains that would not have operated if it were not for the newspaper traffic on them on Saturday night/Sunday morning. Trains 324, 60, 32, 440 and a few more fit this pattern.
Noel Weaver