LV power to D&H 1976

Thanks for the info on Niagara Junction. How would I access that area ? I'd like to get a better idea of where it is at. Some ten years ago I was in that vicinity for a ROW appraisal on the former Westshore that went past the airport and a quarry. I also recall the LV had a tunnel in that area but as I was paid to look at the Westshore and was on short time I didn't get to poke around. Many times flying into Buffalo airport I have tried to pick up vestiges of LV but never really was sure what I was looking at.

As far as the motive power, does anyone know if it was D&H who selected the units and and quantities or did USRA or ??? simply dictate this was the number and type ?

Overall it looks like the D&H got a pretty good selection of units (both off the LV and the RDG) and also with their own order for the 7600's came out pretty good and really enhanced their fleet. CR keeping the Alco RS's and the C628's that one might have figured would have neatly fit into the existing D&H roster very well.

Just came across this nice page about Niagara Junction:

http://mysite.verizon.net/jforys/niagjct/index.html

Looks like there is no real way to access the junction location..without much trespassing..
I wont be trying it...looks like there is nothing to see anyway..

Bing maps:
http://www.bing.com/maps/explore/?org=a ... 1d31mvywcv

Scot

Nice website on Niagara Junction !!

Cactus Jack wrote:Overall it looks like the D&H got a pretty good selection of units (both off the LV and the RDG) and also with their own order for the 7600's came out pretty good and really enhanced their fleet. CR keeping the Alco RS's and the C628's that one might have figured would have neatly fit into the existing D&H roster very well.

The D&H was already beginning to realize the trucks on the C628s were really rough on track before C-Day even came along. In fact, they pulled the C628s from the pooled runs (with LV) by the mid-70s. The C628s were purged from the D&H in 1978, so I don't think the LV units really interested them.

The ex-LV RS-2s and -3s are a bit of a mystery. The D&H still rostered a large RS-3 fleet in the late '70s, so I'm surprised they didn't take any from the LV or EL fleets. Maybe the ex-LV RS-2s/-3s were in such poor condition that the D&H didn't want them, but I don't know for sure.

Likely because given the choice of units, they took most of the newest ones, and compromised on the age of the third group a little versus the large size of the slightly newer C628s.

I mean, if Drew Carey comes up and is going to give you a car, your choice, any car you want, are you going to ask for a new Corvette or a 20-year old Cavalier?

Thanks for the website link on Niagara Junction. We used to go there quite a bit in the months before Conrail, the LV folks there were always very friendly and let us come in to the block house and watch the dispatcher work. I have photos of the inside of the Block builing and the dispatch board, also have a photo of COJ32 at the junction on the evening of March 31 1976. The dispatcher asked COJ32 to slow to a stop as it was on the wye coming off the Niagara Falls Branch as there were a number of prople there to photograph the last EB LV train out of Buffalo before Conrail. I think there were clsoe to 2 dozen guys there that night, it was raining and everyone was staying in the block house and the trailer to stay dry, COJ-32 cam by about 9 pm and was 3 GP38-2 units, a caboose and maybe 5 cars at best, they stopped on the wye for a moment for the photographers and then continued East. We had cars lined up to illuminate the train with headlights, I have a photo somewhere of the event but being a teen, my funds were limited so I did not have flashes or tripods etc. I use the hood or roof of a parked car to steady my camera and got a time exposure of the last EB in the rain lit up by the parked cars. There was a large group there that night, if I recall Ken Kreamer, Devin LAwton, the Late John Baker and others were all there, it was the place to be on the eve of Conrail in Buffalo.
One of my best memories of the old LV was a car caravan arranged by the Buffalo NRHS to the Sayre Shops January 17 1976. It was a wicked cold day but a LARGE number of folks went on this trip (Probably 4 dozen people at least). We toured the LV shops, I recall being just 16 with my first 35 mm camera I had been given at Christmas and arriving at teh Sayre Station and the foot bridge over the engine servicing facilities, going in the shops where they had snowbirds partailly dismantled for repairs and chasing the EL back home to Buffalo through the Beautiful canisteo River Valley until we ran out of light around Hornell. (The LV Main West of Sayre was shut down that day due to a major derailment). One of the best days out with trains ever for me.

Thanks for sharing the memories, Colorado!

Charlie

That sounds like a really meaningful way to see the LV out.. Many thanks for sharing!

MJK

lvrr325 wrote:Likely because given the choice of units, they took most of the newest ones, and compromised on the age of the third group a little versus the large size of the slightly newer C628s.

I'm not saying the D&H shouldn't have taken the C420s and GP38-2s from LV (as well as the RDG GP39-2s). Those engines have proved their worth... and many are still running now. My query is whether the D&H could have taken more (read: additional) locomotives from the CR predecessors... or had a set limit to what it was allowed to take.

One of my best memories of the old LV was a car caravan arranged by the Buffalo NRHS to the Sayre Shops January 17 1976. It was a wicked cold day but a LARGE number of folks went on this trip (Probably 4 dozen people at least). We toured the LV shops, I recall being just 16 with my first 35 mm camera I had been given at Christmas and arriving at teh Sayre Station and the foot bridge over the engine servicing facilities, going in the shops where they had snowbirds partailly dismantled for repairs and chasing the EL back home to Buffalo through the Beautiful canisteo River Valley until we ran out of light around Hornell. (The LV Main West of Sayre was shut down that day due to a major derailment). One of the best days out with trains ever for me.

Four of us were there that day on a separate visit to Sayre. From the footbridge over the Sayre yard, we had noticed a large contingent of people leaving the Sayre Shops. By the time we went over and went inside, everyone had left. Talking with one of the employees there we had found out about the NRHS visit. All four of us were railroaders and we expressed dismay of not knowing of the event. One of our party was an EL man from the Hornell Shops. After a lot of chatter, etc; the LV man basically told us we were free to wander that shops, which we did, unescorted for an hour, if not more. We all took our photographs and left. We we very grateful to him for allowing us to do this.

It was a bitterly cold day, several trains were stacked up at the west end of Sayre yard waiting for the derailment to clear, which I recall was a minor re-railing exercise west of Van Etten Jct.

We had departed for Sayre about 6 AM that day and returned home the next morning at about the same time. We enjoyed the sights, food, fun and drink of the Waverly, Sayre, Athens area. A 24 hour railfan marathon in the days of our youth.

VTM

FWIW, the LV "tunnel" you may have crossed over landing in the plane - it was on the Niagara branch and used to pass under a runway at Buffalo's airport.

At least some of the C420s came north ont the D&H prior to April Fool's day.

I have a shot of a three unit set (all in red) northbound in Central Bridge, NY about a week prior to conveyance. If I recall correctly, they were working AM-1, which normally got C628s as run through power. I don't think they ever went back south.

LV-D&H run-throughs were fairly common, first C628s then C420s. I've seen pix of the C420s on the old D&H main under Starucca Viaduct as well.

One of the other engineers that I worked with was in the mechanical department of the D&H at CR merger time. He said that they had guys at CR terminals to "claim" the new power. As they came in, they had stencils to identify the units as D&H, and to renumber them. The GP38-2s had a 7 put in front of the LV number. My friend had to go to LaGrange for EMD school too. This was because the 7300, 7400, and 7600 classes were the first real experience with EMD power. The 800 class was mostly traded over to EL, while we used some of their Uboats.

Some of the LV, RDG, EL, and PC guys elected to come to the D&H instead of staying with Conrail. For some this was a good move. With Conrail combining the traffic of several lines into one, they would have gotten cut. In other cases a line to become secondary to CR became a main route to D&H. this allowed these guys to not have to move. We still have rosters of former EL, RDG, LV, etc. guys. Certain pools still have turns which are prior righted for D&H Penn Div., LV, etc. This is because part of the run may cover parts on various former seniority districts.

Locomotives and crews were not the only thing to come from Conrail. Some cars and cabooses did too.