London underground bombings

David Benton wrote:What do they do if a train breaks down ?tow it with another train ?

It depends on the nature of the breakdown.
If it is a failure that allows powered movement (such as door interlocks or other safety related issues) then the passengers would be detrained at a station and the train moved empty on a restricted speed to a depot.
If the train cannot move under it's own power, but can be pushed, it is usual for the train behind it to draw-up and push the failed train out to a depot or siding.
If the train cannot move by being pushed (locked wheelsets, derailments etc) then there is an Emergency Response crew who arrive by road with sufficent equipment to make some repairs. They have hand operated four wheel trolleys which can be pushed along the tracks to get equipment to the scene.
If the Emergency Response team cannot effect a repair sufficent to move the train, then the extreme solution is to place skates under the wheels and tow the train out with battery locomotives (which the Underground has for maintenance trains). In this case the train may be split and moved in a number separate movements of some of the cars.

David Benton wrote:i imagine it will be quite a job , clearing the tunnels . are there turning facilites nearby ?, so they can run trains on parts of the route , but not right through .

There are crossover tunnels to allow trains to reverse at certain locations. One of them is just to the south of Kings Cross near the bomb scene so it is not useable for restoration of the service until the scene is cleared. Kings Cross station is also being used for access by the recovery and investigation teams and therefore must remain closed. To the west of Kings Cross the crossover facilities at Hyde Park Corner are being used to reverse the restored service on the western section.
The section north("eastbound") of Kings Cross doesn't have a crossover facility for reversing until Wood Green but it has been decided to use the next one north of there at Arnos Grove and restore service only from north of there.
At Arnos Grove a bus shuttle is being provided to take passengers to and from Finchley Central on the Northern Line. Another bus shuttle is now running between Bounds Green, Wood Green and Turnpike Lane stations to ferry passengers to and from Seven Sisters Victoria Line.

Thanks for the info Geoff . That would tie in with the video i saw on the news item .

geoffs,

Thanks for the info. on the tunnels, I wasn't sure if the train was in one of the original masonry "cut & cover" lines or not, kind of looked that way from the limited news footage I've seen on FOX, CNN and CBS. It looked like the tunnel(s) had suffered some damage, but nothing catastrophic (but again a.) I haven't seen detailed footage and b.) I'm not a structural engineer.)


Also, I would also like to correct myself, I mis-identified the US patriotic song that has the same melody as "God Save the Queen." It's "My Country Tis of Thee," not "America the Beautiful" as I noted above... realized it after I posted, then had modem problems and couldn't connect again until tonight after work. My appologies for that.

More questions , tv coverage tonight from a drivers view , shows 2 rails between the running rails . are these both return "wires" for the electric traction ?.
i know the "live' rail is outside the running rails ,( on one or both sides ? ) , so there's either a total of 3 or 4 power rails .
I do not know if the running rails are used as a return "Wire" , as is done on surface 3rd rail systems .

David Benton wrote:More questions , tv coverage tonight from a drivers view , shows 2 rails between the running rails . are these both return "wires" for the electric traction ?.
i know the "live' rail is outside the running rails ,( on one or both sides ? ) , so there's either a total of 3 or 4 power rails .
I do not know if the running rails are used as a return "Wire" , as is done on surface 3rd rail systems .

When the Underground electrification system was devised the fourth rail was thought necessary to cope with the damp in the tunnels. Whether this is still true, with modern systems, I don't know, but it has been used for all the lines, surface and tube. The middle rail is certainly live.

Komachi wrote:Thanks for the info. on the tunnels, I wasn't sure if the train was in one of the original masonry "cut & cover" lines or not, kind of looked that way from the limited news footage I've seen on FOX, CNN and CBS. It looked like the tunnel(s) had suffered some damage,

The other two bombs (Edgware Road and Aldgate) were in the older cut and cover tunnels. The Kings Cross one was in tube segment tunnel.

There have been tv pictures (from personal cellphone cameras) of all of the locations...
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/in_pictures/4660563.stm
So far the press has not had access to the sites but the Police have released a photo from Aldgate....
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/4668675.stm

temperature at the crash site is reachnig 60 degrees .

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/index.cfm?c_i ... D=10335226

David Benton wrote:temperature at the crash site is reachnig 60 degrees .

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/index.cfm?c_i ... D=10335226

Sad, sad story! IMHO, this madness isn't condonable, under any circumstances.

There was a report in the Observer that the train driver of the Tube train (Piccadilly) was helping injured passengers. So it looks as though he survived. However, I don't see how he could have got into the damaged carriage from his cab as there are reports that the first carriage is seriously damaged.

David Benton wrote: What do they do if a train breaks down ?tow it with another train ?

There are battery powered locomotives. These are also used for maintenance trains.

george matthews wrote:There was a report in the Observer that the train driver of the Tube train (Piccadilly) was helping injured passengers. So it looks as though he survived. However, I don't see how he could have got into the damaged carriage from his cab as there are reports that the first carriage is seriously damaged.

yes , i wondered about that .
perhaps they mean the 2nd onboard employee , the one that opens and shuts the doors , and signals the driver its ok to leave the station . if they still have them .

David Benton wrote:

george matthews wrote:There was a report in the Observer that the train driver of the Tube train (Piccadilly) was helping injured passengers. So it looks as though he survived. However, I don't see how he could have got into the damaged carriage from his cab as there are reports that the first carriage is seriously damaged.

yes , i wondered about that .
perhaps they mean the 2nd onboard employee , the one that opens and shuts the doors , and signals the driver its ok to leave the station . if they still have them .

No, they don't. All these trains are Driver Only. On the automatic lines (Victoria, Jubilee) the driver doesn't even drive.

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/index.cfm?c_i ... D=10335439

cctv camera footage expected to be helpful in identifying the bombers .

David Benton wrote:http://www.nzherald.co.nz/index.cfm?c_i ... D=10335439

cctv camera footage expected to be helpful in identifying the bombers .

All three of the trains that were bombed had passed through Kings Cross. At Kings Cross on the Circle Line the platform is effectively an island - that is, both tracks are accessible from the same area without climbing stairs. In theory one person could have put the bombs on board the two Circle trains from this platform - though surely he would have been spotted doing such an unusual thing.
The Piccadilly line passes beneath but there are a lot of tunnels to pass through to get to it. I think I would need at least five minutes to transfer from Circle to Piccadilly as there is not yet a direct connection (one is planned for the new station).
This suggests more than one person to do the deed. Possibly another member of the group took the bus, perhaps after failing to put a bomb on a Northern or Victoria train which also pass through Kings Cross. He seems to have blown himself up.