Locomotive usage.

I'm wondering what comments there might be regarding the fact that most NYA trains have AT LEAST 2 locomotives. Do they really require that much power for trains that are mostly relatively short, or is it to expedite change in direction? I know that a lot of observers advocate using several light or medium duty engines instead of one heavy one so that an equipment failure might slow the train down instead of crippling it alotgether. But wouldn't it be more efficientto reduce the number of distinct engines, and make them more reliable? After all, part of the advantage of rail transport is that one train does use less fuel, and spews out less pollution, than all of the road vehicles that it replaces.

I am guessing that they will always need a backup because if one engine fails it could really mess up the flow of passenger trains. There is always possibility of failure eve if the engine was new or rebuilt.

Definitely a good idea with 35+year old engines operating on such a busy corridor, such as between Jamaica and Ronkonkoma / Huntington.

Probably a LIRR dictated requirement, no?

LIRR doesn't dictate locomotive usage...although if you were to call the dispatcher and tell them you were looking to take 40 cars out on the main with just Engine 151 they might not let you out for awhile.

There's a lot of benefits for using the two engines. Most jobs at some time will require a second engine, either for horsepower needs or if running a shorter train double-ended to eliminate the need to run around - particularly if you are going somewhere that you can't. If fuel usage is an issue, the one engine can always be isolated. It also is a big help for acceleration with a heavy train, and for mechanical reasons if there is a malfunction. Most crews have two engines available for them when they show up, so why not use them?

Jay

The previous answers provided are appreciated. However, I have run across videos on trains that consisted of 1 MP15 pulling 60 cars. Rather impressive, I think.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rXZO3LQTeEk" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

It is much different to run a train with one locomotive on a freight only branch line than it is to do the same on the LIRR where if that locomotive fails on the road, it's going to take anywhere from an hour to 5 for it to be rescued... which in the process strands commuter trains and creates significant delays to potentially tens of thousands of commuters.

If that happens often enough, said commuters will start complaining very loudly wondering what is wrong with the freight trains and what the LIRR is going to 'do about it'. blowhard politicians like Chuck Schumer get involved, and suddenly you're in a huge PR nightmare that the RR might not survive.

Skimping on locomotives on LI just isn't worth the risk, especially in today's world of instant smart phone complaining.


Also, the train in that video may not have had many major grades. I believe trains on the Bushwick branch get at least one loco per every 5 cars. I've seen them use up to 3 (or the leasor gp + an MP) on trains of just 15-20 cars. For all we know in that video all those cars are empty. UP used to use one big SD loco to haul 100+ coal cars out west... but they're empties going for a reload.

DogBert wrote:It is much different to run a train with one locomotive on a freight only branch line than it is to do the same on the LIRR where if that locomotive fails on the road, it's going to take anywhere from an hour to 5 for it to be rescued... which in the process strands commuter trains and creates significant delays to potentially tens of thousands of commuters.

If that happens often enough, said commuters will start complaining very loudly wondering what is wrong with the freight trains and what the LIRR is going to 'do about it'. blowhard politicians like Chuck Schumer get involved, and suddenly you're in a huge PR nightmare that the RR might not survive.

Skimping on locomotives on LI just isn't worth the risk, especially in today's world of instant smart phone complaining.


Also, the train in that video may not have had many major grades. I believe trains on the Bushwick branch get at least one loco per every 5 cars. I've seen them use up to 3 (or the leasor gp + an MP) on trains of just 15-20 cars. For all we know in that video all those cars are empty. UP used to use one big SD loco to haul 100+ coal cars out west... but they're empties going for a reload.

Plus, those MP's were screaming in notch 8. My point is that the equipment can be pushed more - not that NYA should make a habit of pushing it too much.

MP15's always sound like they're working hard, even in Notch 3 or 4.

The problem is if you ran a train like that over the LIRR and did about 20MPH for an extended period of time, you would have less time if you had to switch a customer enroute, and would certainly delay passenger trains along the way. Do that enough, and you won't be coming out again to play on the mainline anytime soon...

Cab signal failure is the other reason to have 2 units,otherwise you're stuck untill the DS can setup absoute block to protect
the train.

Backshophoss wrote:Cab signal failure is the other reason to have 2 units,otherwise you're stuck untill the DS can setup absoute block to protect
the train.

Only the leading unit can receive the cab code, so you'd have to switch the loco positions somewhere.

Stuck? or slowed? With failed ASC in rule 410 territory, can't you go 15mph/restricted speed? if you're in rule 409, you have block signals to rely on. Anyway at that speed you would very quickly have enough clear railroad ahead to get an absolute block at the next interlocking...

As a freight train,you're a 30 mph slug on a 75 mph mainline under absolute block,untill you clear the west limts of Jay
on the Lower Montauk Sec. (total ASC Fail,total Cab Signal Fail,Or total Fail of both systems)
If it's close to rush hour, the DS will make you wait till after rush hour!

The fact is, they avoid going out during rush hour. That's why they don't go out to Bridgehampton on weekdays, and only stay local in the morning/early afternoon weekdays and leave the major switching in the dark. But you're going by word here and probably not ever seen their operations so I'm not surprised your facts aren't straight.

Interesting post. NYA sister road South Shore does the same thing, and they're in a similar situation of operating freights over a busy passenger railroad. Usually you've got back-to-back geeps at a minimum, even on a short train. I figured thats so they can move a train in case of equipment failure, and also because on return they don't want them running LHF on a busy passenger main.

I could be wrong though - entirely speculation.

CSS&SB probably moves double or more the carloads with roughly the same amount of motive power as NYA. That is one of the reason's the MTA chose them having A&P operation in a similar type of environment with passenger traffic.