Discussion related to commuter rail and transit operators in California past and present including Los Angeles Metrolink and Metro Subway and Light Rail, San Diego Coaster, Sprinter and MTS Trolley, Altamont Commuter Express (Stockton), Caltrain and MUNI (San Francisco), Sacramento RTD Light Rail, and others...

Moderator: lensovet

  by west point
 
What is the status of the proposed viaduct going south from US over the freeway? As i understood this will allow for all trains to not have to back in or back out. Understand that the 2 CPs will allow full train tracking both north and south without necessary changing directions or engineer locations of an inbound.
Also, various models do not show the 3rs tracks between platforms. Is that going to happen?
  by pdtrains
 
I believe the surliners (maybe 12 trains a day, if that, are the only "thru" trains at LAUS, afaik.

All trains, other than up to 3 LD departures and 3 LD arrivals a day, are push-pull. So there are just 3 back up moves in, and 3 back up moves out of the station max a day, and they are all non-rev yard moves.

Really seems that making the station run-thru is a lot of money for very little change in traffic. IMHO, the money could be much better spent elsewhere. Maybe others agree.
  by RandallW
 
There are ~178 daily revenue services either arriving or departing LAX Union Station daily, with station dwell times for through services of 15-20 minutes for through trains. Rebuilding the through tracks (they did once exist, but someone tore them out to build a highway?) would allow 500+ services through LAX since the existing throat would no longer be the constraint for any operator adding or increasing services. (That 178 is a pre-COVID number--counting the trains on the current MetroLink schedule suggests there are ~150 moves revenue moves through the station now.)

In other words, the central constraint on rail services in the hub at LAX Union Station, and there isn't any cheap way to ease that constraint other than move the hub or make the hub a thru station.
  by lensovet
 
Where are the passengers supporting these hypothetical 500+ services a day?
  by RandallW
 
Metrolink is planning on operating all lines with 30 minutes service frequencies in each direction though out the day, which is 250 revenue train movements through LAX during the 6 hour peak, and 678 daily revenue train moves--assuming every train terminates and is reversed in LAX by 2040. This is not driven purely by population growth, but also by a desire to provide service frequencies that would cause people to move from private automobiles to public transportation (being stuck in traffic sucks regardless of being in a new Tesla EV or a 10 year old beat up Honda).
  by lensovet
 
I'm not sure what they are planning but at the moment their farebox recovery ratio is under 20% and their weekday ridership is at 40% of their precovid levels. Who's funding this expansion?
  by ExCon90
 
west point wrote: Mon Sep 04, 2023 3:19 pm What is the status of the proposed viaduct going south from US over the freeway? As i understood this will allow for all trains to not have to back in or back out. Understand that the 2 CPs will allow full train tracking both north and south without necessary changing directions or engineer locations of an inbound.
Also, various models do not show the 3rs tracks between platforms. Is that going to happen?
Afaik when the station opened in 1939 those tracks were intended as escape tracks to permit the engine (generally steam) of an arriving train to cut loose after arrival while the train was still discharging passengers and head for the enginehouse; Idk how much they were so used. With all the push-pull operation today it seems unlikely they would be included now.
  by ExCon90
 
RandallW wrote: Tue Sep 05, 2023 4:13 am There are ~178 daily revenue services either arriving or departing LAX Union Station daily, with station dwell times for through services of 15-20 minutes for through trains. Rebuilding the through tracks (they did once exist, but someone tore them out to build a highway?)
I think almost all the trackage from Mission Tower to the present bumping posts dates from 1939; prior to that the SP's Central Station at 5th and Central served SP and UP, and ATSF had its own La Grande Station at 2nd and La Grande Sts. (scene of a 1940 Laurel & Hardy comedy). In 1939 the tracks at Union Station abutted (one level up) Aliso St., with Pacific Electric's double-track Eastern District running down the middle--so no railroad tracks there.

A note of continuity is provided by renting out the original 1939 ticket lobby for occasional video productions snd other functions.
  by ExCon90
 
I should also mention that the new through connection should save about five minutes ln each direction on the Oceanside and 91-Corridor routes; i.e., those via Fullerton. That's a lot of people, snd based on ridership during the day there seem to be indications that many of them are not going to desk jobs in LA. People closer to the scene will have a clearer picture of how many returning riders fit the the traditional 9-to-5 pattern.
  by RandallW
 
Part of the plan for the extensions is that the non-platform tracks will be removed and platforms widened from 21 to 28 feet.
  by lpetrich
 
Los Angeles Link Union Station is a plan to make Union Station a run-through station; it is currently a stub-end station.

Link Union Station (Link US) - LA Metro
noting
Metro | Link Union Station (Link US)

Reading Link US Draft EIS/SEIR (Volume I) – Main Document I've found a diagram of the planned construction in igure 3.4-20, "Key Views and Proposed Infrastructure Improvements", document page 3.4-41, PDF page 461

The tracks will be extended from the south end of LAUS, and they will curve eastward over Hwy. 101, the Santa Ana Freeway. The tracks will then go eastward just north of E Commercial St. from N Vignes St. to Center St. and they will then curve southward just east of the LA Metro B/Red/D/Purple Line, and meet the tracks on the west side of the Los Angeles River.

The station has 6 platforms with 12 revenue tracks and 2 extra tracks.

This will improve operations for Metrolink and Amtrak, and make LAUS more ready for the CAHSR system. For Amtrak, making the Pacific Surfliner through-running is very obvious, and some Metrolink lines could also be made through-running by connecting north and south ones:
  • North: Antelope Valley, Ventura County, San Bernardino
  • South: Riverside, 91/Perris Valley, Orange County
  by lpetrich
 
Flyover video previews California High Speed Rail at L.A. Union Station | Urbanize LA - June 21, 2023, 8:15AM - "Just don't ask about when we'll actually see this"

As costs soar, Metro scales back plan for Union Station overhaul | Urbanize LA - January 10, 2024, 8:00AM - "Fewer run-through tracks than originally planned"
... in June 2023, the price tag of Link Union Station had ballooned to an estimated $1.93 billion, more than double the $950 million Metro had secured for construction.
From this presentation on Link US
After value engineering, plans how call for a reduction in the number of new-build platforms which would have access to the run-through tracks from seven to four. Those platforms would serve eight different tracks which would converge onto just two tracks crossing the freeway - also a reduction from the original plan which had called for at least four.

...
Even with value engineering, the project would still be split into phases. The initial wave of construction would focus on Union Station's Platform 3, which would be shortened and modified for the approach to the tracks across the freeway.
Utility relocations have already started, and early construction should begin in fall 2025 and heavy construction in summer 2026. No completion date set.

Metro releases new environmental study for Link Union Station | Urbanize LA - June 24, 2024, 8:00AM - "Agency to seek federal money for run-through tracks and expanded passenger concourse"
  by Jeff Smith
 
https://la.urbanize.city/post/storage-b ... ugh-tracks
Storage building to make way for Union Station run-through tracks


After a brief delay, Metro is slated to take a small, but key step toward the long-proposed expansion and renovation of Los Angeles Union Station.

Contractor ERM, Inc. has been given the go-ahead to begin demolishing a vacant storage building located at 801 E. Commercial Street, just south of the US-101 Freeway in Downtown Los Angeles. The building lies within the path of the new run-through tracks which would span from the south side of the station and across the adjacent freeway.

The overhaul of Union Station, branded as Link US, is expected to cost approximately $2 billion to complete, and far outstrips the roughly $1 billion which Metro has raised for construction. Value engineering has ensued to help close the gap, with Metro looking to reduce the number of station platforms with access to the new run-through tracks from seven to four, and the total number of tracks crossing the freeway from four to two.
...