• Is this Locomotive still on display in Lincoln, NH

  • Pertaining to all railroading subjects, past and present, in New England
Pertaining to all railroading subjects, past and present, in New England

Moderators: MEC407, NHN503

  by Pat Fahey
Hi All
Good Job on finding the photo of B&M # 100, that will help answer the question, about the locomotive. Now we know the locomotive at Lincoln, NH at the Depot Mall, is not B&M # 100. Pat
  by GP40MC1118
More roster notes:

B&M 100 Plymouth 3506 6/30 Sold 1941 to Draper Corporation (N.H.). Sold to Beebe River RR (Campton, N.H.)
Notes: 16 Ton, 4-wheel gas locomotive.

Speaking of B&M:

no # Brookville 1163 3/11/27 Retired 1938.
Notes: 8 Ton, 4-wheel gas locomotive equipped with a hoist.
Model FIR (Fordson chassis). Used by Maintenance Of Way Dept.

Also more Beebe River:
no# ML-6 Plymouth BN: 3713 BN: 7/33
Notes: Sold to Alter Co.(Davenport, Ia.) for scrap.
  by Pat Fahey
Hi All
OK Thanks to the help of a lot of people, we found the answer dealing with B&M # 100, along with photo of the locomotive with the herald of the B&M.
OK now according to the Book A short Haul to the Bay By James N.J. Henwood on his roster page is Ex B&M 101 acquired in 1942 the engine became # 33 for the railroad. builder # 3963 an 8 cylinder 30-ton engine was sold in 1959, the book does not note to who or to what RR.
The following photo is not in the book, I google Narragansett Pier RR andfound this photo.
Firefox_Screenshot_2019-12-22T02-57-28.021Z (4.jpg
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  by oibu
Regarding 100, while there are claims circulated about it going to Draper, there is no other evidence of such that I am aware of. Without photos and with no mention of it in the roster in Bill Gove's Logging RRs of the Pemi Valley book (he did pretty exhaustive research and while an occairsional error or omission is always possible, it is pretty unlikely that the B&M unit was overlooked if it was at Draper for any length of time), I doubt it was there. If so, probably not for long. The serial number cited her previously (3506) seems correct based on all info I have.

I took a few minutes and checked what information I have and have now gone back to my previously held position that the Draper/Beebe River unit and B&M 101 are in fact totally different units. More recently for whatever reason I had started to think it "probably" was the same one, but I'm now fully convinced it was two separate units and that the claims of B&M 101 going to Draper are most likely misinformation (that probably came to circulate via circumstantial evidence compounded by the general lower level of interest and data-keeping for "critters' than for full size locos and the passage of time (i.e., since they looked about the same and there weren't tons of them around and few people paid that much attention, it was just logical to "assume" somewhere along the line that the B&M unit from Concord or Keene (I have heard it referenced as shop switcher at both locations) went to Draper then to NPRR and Warwick...)

Per Gove's roster the units owned by Draper were:

1947 DHD 10 ton b/n 5309
1933 ML-6 30 ton b/n 3713 (sold to Iowa)
1927 DLC8 8 ton b/n 2673

whereas, B&M 101 is cited by multiple sources as being b/n 3963 35 ton ML8 blt 1938

The photo on the flatcar posted by Pat I am quite sure -IS- ex B&M 101, probably enroute from Warwick or possibly from NP to Warwick during one of the transactions ca 1956-1959. The color looks to suggest the light blue/gray NPRR used in the 1940s +/- era.

So, I am fairly certain that B&M 101's info as previously provided by GP40MC is correct per below -IF- all reference to Draper/Beebe River is removed:

"101 Plymouth BN: 3963 BD: 3/38 Sold 1941 to Draper Corporation (N.H.). Sold to Beebe River
RR (Campton, N.H.). Sold 1941 to Narragansett Pier 33 (R.I.)
Sold 1956 to Warwick Railway 103 (R.I.).
Sold circa 1960 to Armstrong Cork 4 (Millville, N.J.) after being
rebuilt in 1960 by Plymouth.
Sold 19?? to ?"

Meanwhile, the info in Gove's roster agrees with GP40MC's info on the larger Draper/Beebe River unit ("Also more Beebe River:
no# ML-6 Plymouth BN: 3713 BN: 7/33
Notes: Sold to Alter Co.(Davenport, Ia.) for scrap")

The existence of roster info including a separate builder number and model and disposition is pretty strong evidence of B&M 101 not going to Draper.

But the compelling proof to me is in the dates: Draper took over the Beebe River operation in the early 1930s, used the larger Plymouth to haul logs out ca. 1933-1935, and removed the remaining Beebe River "main line" for scrap ca 1941-42 (after which the Plymouths were used exclusively for switching the mill yard; I would surmise the 1927 unit was more or less retired when the 1947 unit arrived (I have not seen any photos of the 1927 Plymouth that I know of, but this would not be surprising that no pictures were taken or survive of this unit in the 1920s-1940s); supposedly the large Plymouth was kept by Draper after the logging operation shut down and after the purchaseof the 1947 DHD because it could push the snow plow (anyone know what Draper had for a snow plow?).

So the Beebe River as a logging railroad was pretty much done before B&M 101 was even built. And to take it one step further, I have seen photos of the larger Draper unit at Beebe River that are dated 1954 with automobiles visible in the background of styles that did not exist prior to the 1950s, so it had to still have been at Beebe River in the mid-50s, whereas B&M 101 was in Rhode Island long before then by all accounts.

Narragansett Pier 35 came from RCA ca. 1960s, no relation to either B&M or Draper that I have ever heard of. (Is it still at Clarks??)

The above is hopefully a summary that others can follow of that which I believe to be accurate roster/histories for all of the locos brought into question in this thread, with the exception of the remaining question of whether B&M 100 possibly ever passed through Draper.

In any event, some good detective work by all here on some pretty obscure machines! And it also prompted me to revisit the question of B&M 101 vs the larger Draper unit which I had tried a couple of times in the past to verify but always had a little room for question in my mind until now when I compared all of the available data and came up with what I believe is a pretty solid body of evidence.
  by SOCO11

The NPRR is now the William C. O'Neill bike path in RI. You can park right at the Amtrak station.