• Greenway - old ROW in Mt. Morris, NY

  • Pertaining to all railroading subjects, past and present, in New York State.
Pertaining to all railroading subjects, past and present, in New York State.

Moderator: Otto Vondrak

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  by nessman
 
thebigham wrote:This is old news, but I still wanted to let people know.

A new pedestrian bridge was built on the PRR bridge abutments in Mt. Morris. It's 450 foot long!
Neat, yeah. But a parallel $1.7 million pedestrian bridge when there's a new highway bridge crossing the same river a couple hundred feet away? But hey - it's just taxpayer money right?

In any event - just to echo a few comments on here. From what I recall, the slide area in Letchworth State Park was also a contributing factor the the PRR Rochester Branch abandonment as this area was a constant maintenance headache and safety worry. I crossed it on foot myself a few times when biking through there - and as Dan said, there's an underground water source you can see as you walk across. It's dangerous in that slides usually happen without warning.
  by BR&P
 
$1.7 million for a place to walk 450 feet?? Someone should be shot!
  by nydepot
 
Actually there are insurance issues with having the trail utilize state highways, which Rt 36 is. It's cheaper to pay the 1.7 for the bridge than use the highway. There is always more to a story than just seeing $1.7 million. It helps to know that.

Charles
  by BR&P
 
I'm not sure when we started having to create places for people to just walk. We have - right next door to that bridge - a 17-mile long park which is already in place and has roadways, walking paths and wilderness hiking enough to keep someone walking for many years without getting bored. Why there needs to be a separate network of walking trails created at taxpayer expense connecting every possible location,is beyond me. If someone wants to walk that's fine, go walk around the block, or around a county, city or state park. Don't be reaching into my pocket for a trail bridge when there is an existing structure a stone's throw away. They want to walk, they can leave the old PRR long enough to reach that bridge and back to the rail bed on the other side.

"Insurance issues" does not sound like a valid excuse to me. There are sidewalks, pedestrian lanes and roadside trails all over the state and I'm sure insurance is a consideration on all of them. This bridge sounds like a giant boondoggle. Built wide enough for emergency vehicles, when there is a highway right alongside? And now that it has been built it will inevitably require ongoing maintenance and I'm guessing that will be more expensive for a stand-alone structure - even on existing piers - than adding on to the Rt 36 bridge would be.

It may be neat to hike where trains used to roll. But we spend WAY too much public money on this stuff.



There
  by RussNelson
 
Hey, don't harsh on my bridge! I'm planning to bicycle across that bridge, so don't make me feel bad about it. When my wife and I bicycled north to Rochester from there, the bridge was just shy of being completed.
  by BR&P
 
Russ, when I feel a faint tugging on my wallet, I'll know you're riding across! :wink:
  by Scott K
 
So maybe its been built that big and strong for the return of rail service in the future? I heard they're going to reopen and extend the canal tunnel to bypass the slide area, shore it up, and run excursions down from Rochester (Pulled by the E-units from Medina, no less):wink:

Scott K.
  by nessman
 
For some reason, politicians and trail activists seem to think that investing taxpayer dollars in trails will bring economic development to the communities they pass through - which is a bunch of Bravo Sierra.

I don't buy the insurance argument. The Greenway utilizes public roads and crossings in many places - including a road crossing on Rt 36 just a couple hundred yards just north of the $1.7 million Genesee River bridge. So the safety argument is bogus. This was nothing more than an expensive make-work project so some politicians can get a photo-op and pretend they're doing something for their constituents.

Don't get me wrong - the Greenway is a nice asset, but a $1.7 million bridge just a couple hundred feet from a new highway bridge with a sidewalk is huge waste of taxpayer dollars.
  by nydepot
 
Actually Mt. Morris has had a resurgence in fortune to some degree with the investment of the guy who redeveloped Red Hook in Brooklyn. He's done the same for Main St in the village. Several nice stores, restaurants, cafes, etc. Love the homemade food at Questa Lasagna. With the exception of the old Loaf'n Tree outside of town, I never had such good food in Mt. Morris (the old Loaf'n Tree is long gone.). Now I read in the D&C the guy's heading to Brockport.

Anyway, while I'm not on any Board on the Greenway, I am involved in other orgs and the insurance issue is real. It's nice to say you don't buy it from behind your keyboard. It's nice to say "Hey they cross some other road" but you don't know why they cross it, what parts of what roads were agreed to be used (like what roads to detour through the Keshequa Gorge) and what agreements with the state had to happen. There is also grief at the local level. I've read documents concerning liability issues just from walking under the trestle at Letchworth on the trail there.
  by nydepot
 
1.7M of a 1 trillion plus budget is nothing. It came out of the Reinvestment Act. The bridge is a better option than say nutria research in MS or LA. Or even handing it off to some company who doesn't need the hand-out like Wal-Mart. On some things, the money is spent no matter what; better here than there.
nessman wrote:but a $1.7 million bridge just a couple hundred feet from a new highway bridge with a sidewalk is huge waste of taxpayer dollars.
  by sd80mac
 
the bridge is not only used by hiker or bikers.... fishmen did used the bridge to fish.... I cant say if they did fish off RT 36 bridge in past... If so, would that be one of the reasons to get fishmen off the RT 36 bridge?
  by nessman
 
nydepot wrote:1.7M of a 1 trillion plus budget is nothing. It came out of the Reinvestment Act. The bridge is a better option than say nutria research in MS or LA. Or even handing it off to some company who doesn't need the hand-out like Wal-Mart. On some things, the money is spent no matter what; better here than there.
nessman wrote:but a $1.7 million bridge just a couple hundred feet from a new highway bridge with a sidewalk is huge waste of taxpayer dollars.
I'd just rather not see the money spent in the first place. My kids will spend their entire lives paying for this foolish spending.
  by Matt Langworthy
 
nessman wrote:I'd just rather not see the money spent in the first place. My kids will spend their entire lives paying for this foolish spending.
The money had already been budgeted- it couldn't be put back. I agree with nydepot- better for us to spend the money here than in another state.

And... unlike the Adirondacks... there are not alot of rail trails in western NY. Yes, there are a few others, but not much. I don't know if the Greenway will generate much in tourism revenue. On the other hand, those who do use it are getting exercise, which improves health... and that does have a public benefit.
  by thebigham
 
We have 2 threads now on the PRR Rochester Branch. This one and one in the PRR forum.

I think an earlier version of Railroad.net had a longer detailed thread on the PRR's Rochester Branch.

There is not a lot of info on the 'net about this line.

I found these 3 pages of pics of the railroad around Letchworth:

http://www.letchworthparkhistory.com/alongpennsy.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
http://www.letchworthparkhistory.com/alongpennsy2.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
http://www.letchworthparkhistory.com/alongpennsy4.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Pics of the line through Letchworth when it was the Genesee Valley Canal:

http://www.letchworthparkhistory.com/Ph ... chor547342" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Salzberg scrapped the line from Hinsdale to Wadsworth Jct. with a WAG centercab unit.

A good trail map of the Greenway: http://www.fogvg.org/trail_user/maps/ma ... 2-6-09.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

My friend has "adopted" 7 miles of the Greenway through Letchworth so I'm sure I'll be out this fall helping him maintain his section.
  by nydepot
 
A Salzberg engine was used but it was not scrapped by Salzberg. Hyman-Michaels did it.

Charles
thebigham wrote:We have 2 threads now on the PRR Rochester Branch. This one and one in the PRR forum.

I think an earlier version of Railroad.net had a longer detailed thread on the PRR's Rochester Branch.

There is not a lot of info on the 'net about this line.

I found these 3 pages of pics of the railroad around Letchworth:

http://www.letchworthparkhistory.com/alongpennsy.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
http://www.letchworthparkhistory.com/alongpennsy2.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
http://www.letchworthparkhistory.com/alongpennsy4.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Pics of the line through Letchworth when it was the Genesee Valley Canal:

http://www.letchworthparkhistory.com/Ph ... chor547342" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Salzberg scrapped the line from Hinsdale to Wadsworth Jct. with a WAG centercab unit.

A good trail map of the Greenway: http://www.fogvg.org/trail_user/maps/ma ... 2-6-09.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

My friend has "adopted" 7 miles of the Greenway through Letchworth so I'm sure I'll be out this fall helping him maintain his section.
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