Future of the Waterfront Connection

It seems that NJT has all but abandoned the NJCL trains to Hoboken via the Waterfront Connection, which were mostly legacy trains from before the dual mode engines came in (they could run direct service Bay Head-Hoboken). The only train left in the entire system that uses Waterfront is weekday RVL 2406.

As recently as 10-15 years ago, every other weekend RVL train went to and from Hoboken via Waterfront, and NJCL had 5 weekday and 3 weekend round trips to Hoboken. I remember reading somewhere that in the 90s, the NEC even had a Trenton to Hoboken round trip. It is disheartening to see the current state of the track, especially since it was built so recently.

Does anyone know if NJT is planning on beefing up service at any point on the Waterfront Connection? I know that improving it is in the capital plan but they keep cutting service. The track definitely needs some love; 25 minutes between Newark and Hoboken is far too long. I've made it from HOB to NWK in less than 25 minutes via Secaucus before.

We are still are probably barely at 50% of normal work week commuting traffic levels compared to pre-covid. The weekends though apparently are more like 75-80%. Eventually we will get back 2019 levels, but we still might be a year or more away. South of Long Branch NJCL and RVL trains can now use dual modes to go straight in NY Penn, NJ Transit probably has extra slack in the tunnels do to the ridership decline making it possible to offer them to RVL and NJCL South of Long Branch Dual modes.

In the interim the infrastructure bill is law, and NJ Transit does have an expansion of the Waterfront connection in their capital plans.

https://njtplans.com/downloads/capital- ... ansion.pdf

Long term when we get the new Hudson tunnels I still see the need for the direct trains to Hoboken. I think 3 car EMU sets similar to Hoboken-Gladstone sets from the NEC and NJCL might be more realistic than the previous service. Also the Waterfront connection would work for MOM and West Trenton as there probably will not be enough slots even with the new Gateway tunnels.

To help maintain Hoboken as a viable option for riders in the future I think they need to greatly expand ferry services and link them with NJ Transit passes. More frequencies, linked with NJ Transit passes and also offer new connections:

West 39th street, East 34 street, Red Hook, Brooklyn Bridge Park, Williamsburg, Greenpoint, Long Island City and St.George Staten Island.

I would think that the draw is workers in downtown NYC, which means weekdays. I,m too lazy to look at pre Covid NJT , PATH and ferry schedules, but from the coast line for example, what’s the time savings between going to Hoboken via the waterfront connection and then WTC, versus to Newark and then PATH (through Jersey City) to WTC?

pumpers wrote:I would think that the draw is workers in downtown NYC, which means weekdays. I,m too lazy to look at pre Covid NJT , PATH and ferry schedules, but from the coast line for example, what’s the time savings between going to Hoboken via the waterfront connection and then WTC, versus to Newark and then PATH (through Jersey City) to WTC?

That’s the catch, the Waterfront connection should be faster. Having taken it myself it sometimes crawls, speed it up and build the Westbound connection and it would have a huge advantage via standing on the PATH packed in like sardines for 30
Minutes from Newark to the WTC. Also like I said previously, grow the ferry service, more destinations, more frequencies, free transfers for monthly pass holders.


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Yankees1 wrote: ↑Tue Nov 09, 2021 8:56 am It seems that NJT has all but abandoned the NJCL trains to Hoboken via the Waterfront Connection, which were mostly legacy trains from before the dual mode engines came in (they could run direct service Bay Head-Hoboken).

IINGM, those trains were not the former PRR trains that used to change engines at South Amboy, but rather former CNJ trains that were re-routed to Newark Penn when CRRNJ Terminal was closed. (Funny how NJT could still do engine changes with E60s but not with ALP44s, yes?)

Does anyone know if NJT is planning on beefing up service at any point on the Waterfront Connection? I know that improving it is in the capital plan but they keep cutting service. The track definitely needs some love; 25 minutes between Newark and Hoboken is far too long. I've made it from HOB to NWK in less than 25 minutes via Secaucus before.

Unlikely, since they've been discouraging travel to Hoboken for a number of decades now. I once had a ticket agent at HOB ask me why I wasn't using PATH instead, prior to installation of TVMs.

Tom V wrote: ↑Wed Nov 10, 2021 5:38 pm We are still are probably barely at 50% of normal work week commuting traffic levels compared to pre-covid. The weekends though apparently are more like 75-80%. Eventually we will get back 2019 levels, but we still might be a year or more away.

The biggest need, IMO is on weekends.

Since theres only one tunnel into NYC on weekends, the trains all run together. That means you get 2 NEC trains 20 minutes apart and then a 40 minute gap in service. And these days, the trains are PACKED.

Meanwhile, anyone trying to travel WITHIN NJ (it is called NJT isnt it?) is faced with long waits.

Adding a train to Hoboken in the gap would not just allow travel to and from Hoboken, but also create needed options between Trenton and Princeton or New Brunswick and Metropark and whatnot.

Since theres only one tunnel into NYC on weekends, the trains all run together. That means you get 2 NEC trains 20 minutes apart and then a 40 minute gap in service. And these days, the trains are PACKED.

Actually there is only ONE NEC train per hour on weekends, the 7800 series trains at (typically) 14 past the hour. The Coast line trains (7200 series) depart at 07 past the hour (typically) then throw in the odd ball Rahway trains (7600 series) that are carded at 3:56; 5:56; 6:57 and 7:51 - these trains are listed in the NEC timetable (as are the Coast line trains) BUT at NYP show up on the board as Coast Line trains, they are NOT in the Coast Line TTs. I suspect they deadhead down the coast line.
My experience is that the weekend Coast Line trains are EMPTY, this past Sunday I rode the 5:07 out of NYP to Long Branch and basically had an entire car to myself the entire trip. Same on other recent weekends. I do not have any experience on the NEC trains.

There are 2 NEC trains per hour on the weekend at most hours- also 7800 series. These leave NYP around the :52 of the hour so they are the first ones in line when the tunnel opens up for westbound traffic. This makes sense, since these trains run express from EWR to Metropark, so they don't have any trains in front of them.

Regarding the Coast Line, the weekend trains are pretty crowded westbound in the morning and eastbound in the evening, with lots of day trippers heading to the beach. There's not going to be many people heading down the shore on a Sunday night.

I'd really like to see them extend the oddball Rahway Rocket trains to South Amboy (this is where they turn anyway) and then run express service on weekend Coast Line trains from Newark Penn to South Amboy, and maybe even run a few of them as dual modes without the Long Branch switch. Anyone traveling from south of South Amboy to anywhere between Perth Amboy and EWR could change at South Amboy to the local train. This would definitely increase ridership and make the trip from south of Long Branch a lot more bearable.

I missed those EWR to Metropark "expresses! The first one is at 1:55 ! Thanks for the correction. Agree that some weekend express service on the NJCL is really needed, even "off season".

Yes the second NEC train an hour doesnt run all day on weekends, just in the peak direction.

Ive wondered about those Rahway trains. What an odd place to turn them if theres no real turn-back option.

The 9/8/2019 schedule says "Until further notice, Hoboken-bound passengers may travel via Secaucus at the normal Hoboken fare by presenting their Hoboken ticket/pass to the faregate attendant." Is this still in effect? I can't find a newer version of the full paper schedule (r0070.pdf) online, and the temporary schedules don't have fare information.

AJW: NJT NEC (newest 11/14/2021) printed timetables have this sentence below the fare chart:
"Until further notice, Hoboken-bound passengers may travel to Secaucus at the normal Hoboken fare
by presenting their Hoboken ticket/pass to the faregate attendant"
Printed NJT timetables are available at major terminals and staffed stations in case anyone is unaware.

Everyone: The subject about the Waterfront Connection is interesting seeing how NJT has all but eliminated
the WC service option to just one direct train: #2406 from Raritan 5:07 AM arriving Hoboken 6:29 AM.
At all other times a transfer at Secaucus is required. As mentioned there were more HOB trains from both
the NJCL and RVL in the past making the direct HOB option more viable.

Back beginning during the 1990s there were two Peak PM Trenton "Diesel Express" runs (as noted in NEC
schedules) with one originating at HOB via the WC and the other at NWK to TRE on weekdays. I rode those
trains since they were an alternative to crowded NEC trains originating at NYP boarding at either HOB or
NWK offering a seat on either train as compared to having to stand or compete for a seat otherwise.
First stops were Metropark and/or New Brunswick on those two trains as I recall.

At Trenton the two trains were platformed back-to-back and than coupled together for a fast nonstop
deadhead run to the MMC Facility - they were an interesting sight running on the NEC together at speed.

Sometime in the early 2000s the "Diesel Express" trains were discontinued for more NEC trains from NYP.
This was once a good NEC option that unfortunately was not retained by NJT...MACTRAXX

It seems an underused asset to me. Hoboken has the PATH, ferries, light rail - plus itself as a destination/population center, and is adjacent to JC. I would think there is demand - especially as it can augment local service, as mentioned. Not least, to pick up folks at Newark heading south/west - just before a NYP train might arrive.

If the Hunter work is done properly, it could be an even better way to encourage frequency (and TOD) along the RVL - and clear those terminators out of Newark.

It should be far quicker too. It's also a critical way into midtown if the tunnels/Penn are down, via the 6th Ave PATH. Plus the Village etc which I don't think is that well utilized or known.