• Future of Septa Regional Rail Fleet

  • Discussion relating to Southeastern Pennsylvania Transportation Authority (Philadelphia Metro Area). Official web site can be found here: www.septa.com. Also including discussion related to the PATCO Speedline rapid transit operated by Delaware River Port Authority. Official web site can be found here: http://www.ridepatco.org/.
Discussion relating to Southeastern Pennsylvania Transportation Authority (Philadelphia Metro Area). Official web site can be found here: www.septa.com. Also including discussion related to the PATCO Speedline rapid transit operated by Delaware River Port Authority. Official web site can be found here: http://www.ridepatco.org/.

Moderator: AlexC

  by Silverliner5
 
of course they can cause whatever they have overseas they can pull it off in the US with some minor changes
  by scratchyX1
 
Stadler also has some EMU/DMU/BMU they have brought over , with minor changes.
  by mcgrath618
 
I would keep a close eye on this one. Stadler is working on an NEC-oriented version of the KISS that would be ADA for both high and low level platforms. Would be the perfect acquisition for SEPTA.

In speaking with Ryan Judge, head of planning of SEPTA, he seemed to imply that the SLVIs would not be a full fleet replacement and would only serve to eliminate about a hundred or so of the worst units. Considering it's antithetical to everything SEPTA has communicated with the public so far, I am wondering if planning/fleet acquisition are genuinely considering this or if they're just on totally different worlds.
  by rcthompson04
 
McGrath, such an approach might be a good idea if SEPTA does go to a more metro style setup for at least some operations while having other operations being commuter focused.
  by mcgrath618
 
rcthompson04 wrote: Fri Jun 24, 2022 11:30 am McGrath, such an approach might be a good idea if SEPTA does go to a more metro style setup for at least some operations while having other operations being commuter focused.
In reality, what the Railroad will end up being is somewhere between Options 1 and 2. They'll likely move to start having 30 minute headways everywhere before supplementing these with extra trains that would make headways 15 minutes everywhere else.

The issue is that the stations only become ADA compliant if every train stopping there is low-level compliant. If SLIVs and SLVs were kept in addition to any multilevel fully ADA compliant train (Stadler or other), they would still not be considered compliant stations by the federal government and SEPTA would have to continue doing high level conversions.

High levels make sense at high-ridership stations like Ardmore but ultimately I believe that it's not worth the money at lower ridership stations when this end-all option is available. I saw that Wynnewood was on their budget for high level conversion; that station is very dear to me and I would hate to see its platforms taken OOS for a benign high level design.

One of the largest portions of SEPTA's maintenance backlog is ADA compliance. That goes away with ADA compliant low levels. Now that money can go into track improvements and other infrastructure concerns.
  by PHLSpecial
 
Even if Septa replaced the SLIV and SLV with the Stadler Kiss wouldn't those low platform stations need to still to build level platforms? I know most stations are step on. Regardless Septa still needs to spend money on leveling platforms for both high and low platforms. Once this is money is spent on all the stations we would see faster boarding times. Small time savings but still important.

Hopefully some core routes will be 15 minute headways like the airport, Jenkintown, maybe Fox Chase, some of the Paoli line. I'm slowly shifting my opinion for option 1 to start.
  by Silverliner5
 
Since they are replacing a few Silverliner 4s is it possible for septa to at least buy a train like this one called the Keisei Skyliner AE01? Although there could be a way to make it cheaper for them to buy
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  by Silverliner5
 
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I suggest these units for septa to buy to replace the Silverliner 4s but I know they may cost a lot of money but there could be a way to cut the price and get the amount septa needs anyways what do you guys think of these units here and also is there a way for me to contact Ryan about these trains as well?
  by PHLSpecial
 
Those are really awesome train sets, would be great for the metro portion of the RR. TBH I think we should not have a dedicated fleet for metro style service.
We need to have one platform, not multiple platform heights. I'm not sure if those train sets can be modified to have multiple platform heights while still having level boarding without a ramp plate.

Though our stations are so close together so I don't have a strategy on what style service septa needs to run for best case ridership. Once Septa decides the type of RR service they want to run, Septa will order trains based off that.

That leads me too going for all day 30 minute service on all lines while part of the other lines will get 15 minute service or better.
  by rcthompson04
 
I like the 30 minute all day service with 15 minute on select lines all day and 15 minutes during peak periods.
  by MACTRAXX
 
rcthompson04 wrote: Mon Jun 27, 2022 12:48 pm I like the 30 minute all day service with 15 minute on select lines all day and 15 minutes during peak periods.
RCT - Right now SEPTA ridership as it stands does NOT support an increase more than hourly service
off peak - along with the numbers of current T&E crew members - in particular Engineers - needed to provide
RRD service...Initially getting half hourly service back to the Paoli and Lansdale routes would be a start...

S5-What SEPTA would need at this point is a Silverliner Five-type car with both high and low level platform
capabilities - and at least 125 of these cars - preferably more - to make an attempt to totally replace the S4
cars - which are nearing 50 years in service (1974-1975-1976 build dates) thanks to their being overhauled
back around the year 2000 with new interiors as example...It may take years - and millions of dollars - for
high-level platforms to be constructed at EVERY RRD station...

MCG - You mention of Wynnewood Station with high-level platforms would change the historic aspect of
the station area - Did you ever notice how SEPTA was able to combine some vintage PRR station elements
with high-level platforms at WAYNE? ANY station that has a historic building (Strafford is a perfect example)
or other preservable vintage structure aspects should be kept if possible when and if high-level platforms
are built - I often wondered why SEPTA built high-level plaforms on the Doylestown Branch as example
instead of at much busier stations (Glenside-Jenkintown and south on the RDG side and Overbrook to
Paoli inclusive on the PRR side best examples) where they would more practical...

S5-As far as I know Ryan is involved in SEPTA ticket sales as an Edens Corporation employee (outside contractor)
and is not involved with SEPTA directly such as RRD equipment procurement from his posts - keep in mind I
can NOT speak directly FOR him here...MACTRAXX
  by ryan92084
 
MACTRAXX wrote: Mon Jun 27, 2022 2:49 pm S5-As far as I know Ryan is involved in SEPTA ticket sales as an Edens Corporation employee (outside contractor)
and is not involved with SEPTA directly such as RRD equipment procurement from his posts - keep in mind I
can NOT speak directly FOR him here...MACTRAXX
Pretty sure S5 was talking about Ryan Judge (brought up earlier by mcg) and not me. But it is accurate that i have no sway with SEPTA planning :wink:
  by CNJGeep
 
mcgrath618 wrote: Fri Jun 24, 2022 12:13 pm I saw that Wynnewood was on their budget for high level conversion; that station is very dear to me and I would hate to see its platforms taken OOS for a benign high level design.
Please let that one be next. Every westbound trip with Vs there's a door hang up, same as Claymont. When the dynamics fail on the GEs (which is virtually every trip in this heat) and the engineer misses the step up, getting the passengers on on the #1 track side is a disaster. All they need to do is take the west end of the platform and move it three cars east off the curve.

Rosemont too, while we're at it.
  by CNJGeep
 
MACTRAXX wrote: Mon Jun 27, 2022 2:49 pm
rcthompson04 wrote: Mon Jun 27, 2022 12:48 pm I like the 30 minute all day service with 15 minute on select lines all day and 15 minutes during peak periods.
RCT - Right now SEPTA ridership as it stands does NOT support an increase more than hourly service
off peak - along with the numbers of current T&E crew members - in particular Engineers - needed to provide
RRD service...Initially getting half hourly service back to the Paoli and Lansdale routes would be a start...

S5-What SEPTA would need at this point is a Silverliner Five-type car with both high and low level platform
capabilities - and at least 125 of these cars - preferably more - to make an attempt to totally replace the S4
cars - which are nearing 50 years in service (1974-1975-1976 build dates) thanks to their being overhauled
back around the year 2000 with new interiors as example...It may take years - and millions of dollars - for
high-level platforms to be constructed at EVERY RRD station...
1) SEPTA ran a pre-pandemic schedule with 168 engineers. The roster is hovering just under 200 now.
2) The overhaul on the Silverliner IV cars was effectively new seats and that's about it. Unlike the Arrow III cars, NO type of mechanical overhaul or improvement was made. All the mechanical components, the electrical equipment, everything inside those cars is effectively the same stuff it rolled out of the factory with. The only new mechanical features on those cars is the PTC. If you sit in the nook in the middle there are two cabinets in front of you filled with 1970s relay equipment.
  by rcthompson04
 
Rosemont might be the most difficult station to address on that line once Downingtown is replaced.
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