FGLK Route History - ex-PRR

NS runs six axles on the Corning Secondary including the track between Himrod Junction and Geneva. And yes, the ROW has seen substantial improvement in the recent past from Baker Street to Dresden (and to a lesser extent north of Dresden) in expectation of heavier coal drags to Greenridge.

I actually remember seeing the decapods on the PRR Northern Division back in the day but the ROW has remained basically unchanged from that time. Between Himrod and Watkins Glen everything is pretty straight up or down the grade and the ROW looks okay. There are a couple of curves in Watkins Glen that might be a little tight for a six axle, however. Himrod to Penn Yan is an entirely different situation now -- I believe that the four axle is limited to less than 10 mph. BTW, and FWIW, most of the in-place track on both segments is the same track that was there in the PRR days.

Poppyl

The line NS runs on is former New York Central, not PRR.

Sidings too tight for big engines could be handled with idler cars; the line to Penn Yan is an exception, but when they're finally done with the B23s they could easily get one or two other 4-axles to handle it.

He was referring to the Watkins Glen line with PRR steam.

lvrr325 wrote:There is some crap track on that line, to be sure, but it was built to handle PRR 2-10-0s hauling coal up to Lake Ontario. I would think with some money spent cleaning up the worst parts of it it could handle six-axle power.

Agreed. Pennsy even ran some six axle power on the line back in the 1960s.

Okay, I'll run up the white flag on six axle power at least between Himrod and WG. Still not so sure about Himrod-PY as the track and ROW currently exists, however.

Can't forget that PC routinely ran six axles off the Secondary to the Himrod yard (at least twice the capacity of what's there today) during the time that the mine was in operation in the early 70's. I believe that the daily runs were two loads out and two empties in. As far as I know, nothing ran between WG and Himrod during that period as WG traffic was handled out of Southport.

Poppyl

poppyl wrote: Can't forget that PC routinely ran six axles off the Secondary to the Himrod yard (at least twice the capacity of what's there today) during the time that the mine was in operation in the early 70's. I believe that the daily runs were two loads out and two empties in. As far as I know, nothing ran between WG and Himrod during that period as WG traffic was handled out of Southport.

If nothing ran between Watkins Glen and Himrod during the early '70s, how did PC get to Southport? Did they have trackage rights on EL?

Northern Central/PRR had trackage rights over Erie/EL between Southport and Horseheads from the very beginning. NC/PRR also had much local freight in Horseheads and Elmira and a yard in Elmira off the Erie between 2nd and 5th Streets.

Kind of off topic, but until Agnes the line was in service from Newberry all the way to Seneca Castle or so. Agness killed the line below Southport. I found one comment that it also caused Watkins Glen to Horseheads to be shut down, although I recall reading somewhere that washed out a couple of years later (1974).

Going out on a limb, I'd presume PC could reach remaining track in the area via the EL from Corning, or have the LV handle the business for them.

And while we're on location info - here are a few pics from the 50's/60's if anyone's interested.

Amazing photos.......so crystal-clear! Thanks so much for the info and sharing these fine shots.

Charlie

A couple more. Late 50's. Note the sand tower (and steam) is gone and the position light train order signal is lit.....

Train Detainer wrote:Northern Central/PRR had trackage rights over Erie/EL between Southport and Horseheads from the very beginning. NC/PRR also had much local freight in Horseheads and Elmira and a yard in Elmira off the Erie between 2nd and 5th Streets.

I apologize for not being more specific. Poppyl stated there was no services between Watkins Glen and Himrod in the early '70s, so I was curious about how PC accessed the Southport to Horseheads segment.

lvrr325 wrote:Kind of off topic, but until Agnes the line was in service from Newberry all the way to Seneca Castle or so.

Ah, that would explain how PC serviced Southport to Horseheads before Agnes.

lvrr325 wrote:I found one comment that it also caused Watkins Glen to Horseheads to be shut down, although I recall reading somewhere that washed out a couple of years later (1974).

The line was damaged by a flood in 1975, but repaired again. I recall seeing a local at the Route 14 crossing in Montour Falls in either late '75 or early '76. I've also seen a photo of a James E Strates train in Montour Falls in 1974. Perhaps CR noted what happened there and ultimately chose the grade out of Watkins Glen over the flood prone gulch south of town.

lvrr325 wrote:Going out on a limb, I'd presume PC could reach remaining track in the area via the EL from Corning, or have the LV handle the business for them.

I was wondering the same thing, and would like to get confirmation if possible.

Train Detainer wrote:A couple more. Late 50's. Note the sand tower (and steam) is gone and the position light train order signal is lit.....

gptr_0003_1.jpg

gptr_0001.jpg

Great shots! Thanx for sharing. Man, alot has changed there!

Just to clarify my earlier statement about no service south of Himrod in the early seventies, while the Himrod mine was in operation, CR stored empty hoppers on the line south of their Himrod yard. That wouldn't seem to me to make much sense if they were running service to Watkins from Himrod. Now, once the mine closed in 1972/1973, the hoppers disappeared. By then I had left the area so I don't know if the service situation changed after the mine closed.

Poppyl

Seems to me that service to Montour Falls lasted through 1981. The last time I went through town there was a large, empty, formerly railroad served industry there. I'm getting the date from someone's article on building a model of the frieght station.

Conrail may have simply decided it was better to base a local at Himrod and run two stub branches from there, than to try to serve Penn Yan and the LDL above it with one local and the Watkins Glen customers out of Elmira.