Dropping Cars.... again

heres a test for ya, your on a roadswitcher and you have 9 lds of cement to spot and you don't want to call the disp. to get authority on the siding to run around your cut so you can spot this customer. the industry track for this customer is on a descending grade. what do you do?

Go home sick...

Good luck Kevin... Keep us posted!

git a holt to it wrote:heres a test for ya, your on a roadswitcher and you have 9 lds of cement to spot and you don't want to call the disp. to get authority on the siding to run around your cut so you can spot this customer. the industry track for this customer is on a descending grade. what do you do?

You do the move in a safe manner and in accordance with the rules, if you
have to call the dispatcher, you call the dispatcher. Any other ideas are
a NO GO.
Noel Weaver

git a holt to it wrote:heres a test for ya, your on a roadswitcher and you have 9 lds of cement to spot and you don't want to call the disp. to get authority on the siding to run around your cut so you can spot this customer. the industry track for this customer is on a descending grade. what do you do?

Stop take lunch read the newspaper call the wife tell her you'll be home late go for the overtime. After that call the dispatcher get permission if that is needed if you have a good engineer he'll know how to work with air on this grade if uncertian tie a few handbrakes to help control the movement. Then again you stated your in the siding why do you need the dispatchers permission to run around the cars?

Or, even if you DO need track authority, why would you not want to ask for it? If your job is to spot the cement, get permission, run around 'em, and spot the cement, end of story.

git a holt to it wrote:heres a test for ya, your on a roadswitcher and you have 9 lds of cement to spot and you don't want to call the disp. to get authority on the siding to run around your cut so you can spot this customer. the industry track for this customer is on a descending grade. what do you do?

If the siding is also on a grade, cut the engine away and put it in the customer's siding, then bleed off the cars until they start to roll. Jump on the last car (or second from last car) as soon as it starts to roll downgrade, then control the speed with the handbrake! Stop cut of cars past switch leading into industry, then throw switch, bring engine out, and tie onto cut of cars!! Serve customer and afterwards, do what others have suggested, such as take lunch, read newspaper, etc. Simple!!!

I don't think I'd be too keen on rolling 9 cars with handbrakes. If nothing else, I'd tie some down, pull a pin and try it with 3 or 4, then repeat. There are a lot of variables such as how steep is the grade, how exact a spot do you have to make, are there any crossings to go over, what is beyond in case you don't get them stopped with handbrakes.

But if you have an engine, and a runaround, why bother with rolling them anyway? Run around with the loco and spot them normally. Some guys go through more work trying to get out of work, than they had to do in the first place.

CSX Engr, if you follow your suggestion, and for whatever reason you can't stop those 9 loads on the siding with handbrakes, you're going to be in a world of chit. Explain to your dispatcher why you ran them out onto the main, or over a derail, and you'll wish you had just run around them like normal.

And IF, for some reason, you absolutely HAD to roll them by, you start on the first car, at the bottom, with a handbrake there. NOT at the last one or two cars. By riding the first car (or the first couple, if you can get two wheels back-to-back), you have the ability to catch a following car, and applying more brake, next car, etc...... You are in a big world of hurt, grabbing the last one or two, then finding you have no control, as you watch them roll away from you. Before it became "illegal", we would have bottled them, and rode the lead car, and dump the air, as we got into the clear of the engine, so we could recouple, and spot them with the power attached. You need good qualified guys to do this, who don't mind busting the air, on the lead end of a movement. (we rode the lead, so if needed, we could still apply handbrakes. we didn't usually test the train, to see if it would stop when it was dumped. it was just assumed it would stop. yeah, I know, don't even say it) With it being so much easier to just run-around them, though, I can't imagine why you just wouldn't do it the way they want it done. A lot of what we "used to do" is now illegal, and the amount of guys who died, or were maimed doing it, are the reasons we can't/don't do it, anymore. If you are spotting cars, I guess you are on a local. I also guess, then, you are paid by the hour. Man, I wouldn't care if the DS never let me out, to run-around those cars. Money for nothing, is not such a bad deal. Do it by the rules, and get paid for doing it. That's what they want, so "give it" to them..................

One more thing - CSX Eng, not picking on you but I sure disagree with one thing you said. If I was going to try that stunt, I would start out on the lead car, or maybe #2 and 3 if there were 2 brakes together. But not the rear or second rear. If you are back there and the one or two brakes don't hold them, you're gone. At least toward the front you have the option of dropping off and catching another car to wind another one on.

I'm sure it HAS been done in the past. But to me it still sounds like an invitation to an investigation.

Hey GA, I guess great minds think alike, LOL! Two posts right to the same minute.

WOW, Aji. We both posted the same advice, at the same time. That is really cool. I guess you had the same old-heads, riding your butt back in the day, too..........................

Well, I have been chewed out by the old timers a time or two. With time you just seem to develop a gut feeling of things that are apt to get your a$$ in a sling. (my gut feeling still does not work 100% of the time LOL). Yeah it can be done (rolling 9 loads) but to me it just sounds like trouble, there are way too many things that can go wrong.

You are right about bottling the air although with my luck there would be a leaker and the cars would die halfway to where you wanted, probably enough off the hill that they would not roll when you bleed them off but not far enough to get your engine out if you somehow had it blocked in. "Uh dispatcher....ah, we kinda got a problem....."

Just like the rules are written because of guys before you who learned the hard way, so also you learn with time to avoid things that can set you up for problems. I'm not sure what the reason in the original questions was, why he did not want to ask the DS for track authority. but 9 loads of cement controlled by handbrakes just does not sound like a good way to insure continued employment. "You will arrange to report for an investigation. The purpose of this investigation is to develop facts and determine your responsibility, if any, in connection with....." Yup, I've been on the receiving end of THAT a few times.

Yeah, you would always ride the lead car in got to see what your doing. I didn't hear anyone state testing the hand brakes to make sure they work that's an important one. We use to do this years ago I can't count how many times the cars ended up going off the end of the track because there was grass and weeds covering it. The regular brakemen knew the spot, but when we got one off the extra board that was another story.

GOLDEN-ARM wrote: Before it became "illegal", we would have bottled them, and rode the lead car, and dump the air, as we got into the clear of the engine, so we could recouple, and spot them with the power attached.

GA you almost hit the nail on the head, only difference was we spiked fred. To answer your questions as to why, It was derby day and that damn disp. dosn't answer the radio and if we got permission then we'd have to go way down to the W/E of the house... well you know how it works, would make that 5 min move into a 40 min move. A 3 hour quit is hard to get so you take it when its there.