Did NH ever connect with the CNJ in the Bronx?

The CNJ had a small, isolated yard just north of NH Harlem River Yard. Was there ever a physical connection between the two?

-otto-

I don't think so, and there would be little reason for such a connection, since all NH-CNJ interchange was done by carfloat to/from Jersey City.

The November 1989 issue of Railpace includes a nice track map of CNJ's Harlem River yard, apparently redrawn from a company map. The yard's east end shows no trackage extending beyond Lincoln Ave., where a number of team tracks dead-ended.

BaltOhio wrote:I don't think so, and there would be little reason for such a connection, since all NH-CNJ interchange was done by carfloat to/from Jersey City.

The November 1989 issue of Railpace includes a nice track map of CNJ's Harlem River yard, apparently redrawn from a company map. The yard's east end shows no trackage extending beyond Lincoln Ave., where a number of team tracks dead-ended.

That makes a lot of sense. Figured I would ask since the two were so close.

Here's a link to a great photo of the CNJ Bronx Terminal, 1944:

http://www.bronx-terminal.com/wp-conten ... xlarge.jpg

Looking towards the south/east, the long spindly swingbridge and trestle is carrying the Second Avenue El from Manhattan into the Bronx. The next bridge is the Willis Avenue Bridge, then the Triboro Bridge. Quite the compact facility! There does not appear to be any tracks reaching towards the New Haven's yard.

-otto-

The only rail to rail direct connections that the New Haven had in New York City were between the New Haven and the New
York Central at Woodlawn for passenger trains and at Oak Point/Port Morris for freight. The connection between the New
Haven and Pennsylvania through the Long Island tower at Harold into Sunnyside Yard and Pennsylvania Station for passenger
and finally the connection at Fremont between the New Haven and the Long Island for freight traffic.
Anything else was done by car floats at the very end the only active car floats were at Bay Ridge which the New Haven
reached by trackage rights over the Long Island from Fremont to Bay Ridge but until the mid 60's also from Oak Point.
When Oak Point was operating we interchanged with the LV, CNJ and the Brooklyn terminal railroads through car floats at
Oak Point and with the PRR at Bay Ridge again by float. All of the Oak Point stuff was moved to Bay Ridge when the float
bridges at Oak Point got so bad that they could not safely and dependably be used and the NHRR did not have the money to
rehab them. The bridges and facilities at Bay Ridge were maintained by the Long Island and were in much better shape.
There was also sufficient capacity at Bay Ridge for the remaining interchange business through New York. I believe some of
the LV and CNJ interchange traffic was shifted to Maybrook when Oak Point floats ended operation. It could be handled
through the interchange with the L&HR to Allentown for the LV, CNJ and Reading as well.
Noel Weaver

None of the small Bronx, Queens, or Brooklyn "pocket" yards were connected to the "outside world", aka the trunk line railroads.

The Erie, LV, DL&W and CNJ in the Bronx, the BEDT in Queens, and the BEDT, PRR, JSC, NYD, BTR, and DL&W in Brooklyn, were all served exclusively by carfloat .

CF

In this photo...

http://flickr.com/photos/ottomatic77/2889279017

I'm standing on the Third Avenue Bridge. The area where the school busses are, is that where the CNJ yard was?

-otto-

Otto -

Yes it is, but closer to the edge of the photo and off to the left. The CNJ had a tunnel under near the bridge approach to another later extension.
http://www.bronx-terminal.com/

RAH

CAR_FLOATER wrote:Otto -

Yes it is, but closer to the edge of the photo and off to the left. The CNJ had a tunnel under near the bridge approach to another later extension.
http://www.bronx-terminal.com/

RAH

I think the tunnel can be seen a bit to the right of the track in the photo (the red auto is above the tunnel). Also, the indent in the water at the center bottom I suspect is the float bridge remnant.

http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&hl=en&g ... 3&t=h&z=20

Ken -

You are correct, the indent in the shore line is where the float bridge was. The same thing can be see at the Erie and LV Bronx terminals as well.

I don't see the photo you do, but I do not think the "tunnel" is still open, I was past this spot twice this summer, and did not see it, but that doesn't mean it wasn't starring me in the face, either! Also, unlike the Erie and LV yards, there is nothing left here of railroad infrastructure to see anymore.

RAH

CAR_FLOATER wrote:Ken -

You are correct, the indent in the shore line is where the float bridge was. The same thing can be see at the Erie and LV Bronx terminals as well.

I don't see the photo you do, but I do not think the "tunnel" is still open, I was past this spot twice this summer, and did not see it, but that doesn't mean it wasn't starring me in the face, either! Also, unlike the Erie and LV yards, there is nothing left here of railroad infrastructure to see anymore.

RAH

I can't tell if its been walled-in, but it was about where I marked the following grab from the Google Map photo. That's about where prints I've seen located the tunnel, and if you look north of the bridge on Google Map's photo it looks a bit like a now paved right of way for a couple or three hundred feet was there.

By looking at the 1944 photo, the black roofed building currently just north of the 3rd Ave Bridge (behind Storage Delux) [shown on http://maps.live.com/]appears to be where the 'round house' freight terminal was located?? Also the 1944 photo has what looks like a float bridge just to the river side of the 'round house' which would be up river from the 3rd Ave bridge? You can also see the line of freight cars going under the 3rd Ave Bridge down river.

CarterB wrote:By looking at the 1944 photo, the black roofed building currently just north of the 3rd Ave Bridge (behind Storage Delux) [shown on http://maps.live.com/]appears to be where the 'round house' freight terminal was located?? Also the 1944 photo has what looks like a float bridge just to the river side of the 'round house' which would be up river from the 3rd Ave bridge? You can also see the line of freight cars going under the 3rd Ave Bridge down river.

The entire facility was south of the bridge. The line of cars under the bridge and to the north was to serve a customer north of the bridge, but could also be used as a switching lead to the float bridge, I believe.

I was on a river tour sponsored by a rail history organization 15 or 20 years ago and saw the remnants south of the bridge as I recall.

As a point of detail, if anyone cares, this yard was closed by the CNJ in 1961.

RAH

Ken W2KB

Postby Otto Vondrak on Mon Dec 22, 2008 2:58 pm
Here's a link to a great photo of the CNJ Bronx Terminal, 1944:

http://www.bronx-terminal.com/wp-conten ... xlarge.jpg

Looking towards the south/east, the long spindly swingbridge and trestle is carrying the Second Avenue El from Manhattan into the Bronx. The next bridge is the Willis Avenue Bridge, then the Triboro Bridge. Quite the compact facility! There does not appear to be any tracks reaching towards the New Haven's yard.

-otto-

1944 photo sure looks like the facility was North of the 3rd Ave Bridge (upriver)??