• Delaware and Raritan River Railroad-General Discussion

  • Pertaining to all railroading subjects, past and present, in New Jersey
Pertaining to all railroading subjects, past and present, in New Jersey

Moderator: David

  by CharlieL
 
And here's another rumor for you, third-hand from a NJT guy: They're examining (again, for time #3 or 4) passenger service on the southern. Lakewood-Red Bank? Something about congestion on NJCL and Bay Head facilities. Note: I do not know the source, but the guy who passed it on to me I can trust. Almost like MOM shortened to MO.
  by Bracdude181
 
@CharlieL Something about that doesn’t sound right. Congestion in Bay Head? Didn’t they just clear up a ton of space in there by getting rid of the decrepit Comet III cars that had been sitting there for the better part of a decade? Plus, Bay Head to Long Branch is practically desolate now. There’s 4 NY directs and the shuttle, which at its current schedule leaves a lot to be desired. It’s partially why there’s no ridership on that section now.

Its busy from South Amboy and points north partially because of the SA directs. Long Branch gets a little crowded too but that’s about all I know about congestion.

MOM shortened to MO makes sense considering all the backlash NJT got when they put forward proposals to run trains through Jamesburg and the like.

I just don’t see it happening. Not yet anyways. Especially with the Hudson River tunnel situation. (T I C K. T O C K. T I C K. T O C K.) Without that you won’t be able to accommodate both the NY bound trains on the NJCL and whatever traffic Lakewood generates. Which would be a lot if it’s setup right.
  by JohnFromJersey
 
Bracdude181 wrote: Sun Oct 02, 2022 6:00 pm Tuesday and Thursday was the schedule under Conrail for a while. Perhaps C&D could try this if Friday runs are this much of an issue. Freehold does not see enough traffic right now to justify three runs a week. Monday and Wednesday would be more than enough.
Agreed - or they could Saturday (in the day) runs when the Lakewood crowds are usually staying inside. I remember one of the last Tuesday runs before Gold's closed down.
CharlieL wrote: Sun Oct 02, 2022 7:11 pm And here's another rumor for you, third-hand from a NJT guy: They're examining (again, for time #3 or 4) passenger service on the southern. Lakewood-Red Bank? Something about congestion on NJCL and Bay Head facilities. Note: I do not know the source, but the guy who passed it on to me I can trust. Almost like MOM shortened to MO.
Interesting. Certainly needed. One of my theories was NJT using C&D to do some of the initial track work for a MO(M) project. Would also allow for the rails north of Farmingdale to Red Bank to be free of freight use.
Bracdude181 wrote: Sun Oct 02, 2022 9:08 pm @CharlieL Something about that doesn’t sound right. Congestion in Bay Head? Didn’t they just clear up a ton of space in there by getting rid of the decrepit Comet III cars that had been sitting there for the better part of a decade? Plus, Bay Head to Long Branch is practically desolate now. There’s 4 NY directs and the shuttle, which at its current schedule leaves a lot to be desired. It’s partially why there’s no ridership on that section now.
There's no demand for LB-BH right now. Summer is pretty much over, you don't have the crowds of people hopping off the trains at Belmar to head over to Bar A for beat the clock anymore. If NJ was warmer for most of the year like Florida or California, LB-BH would be swamped 24/7 instead of just being swamped Memorial Day-Labor Day, barely a three-month seasonal height.
Bracdude181 wrote: Sun Oct 02, 2022 9:08 pm Its busy from South Amboy and points north partially because of the SA directs. Long Branch gets a little crowded too but that’s about all I know about congestion.
Because Long Branch north is where all the year-round population density is. The Shore Points NJT serves get even denser than many North Jersey towns and cities in the summer, as someone who grew up going to school in Belmar the population would increase 10x, if not more, in numbers from May-September, but they all go away when it starts getting cold again.
Bracdude181 wrote: Sun Oct 02, 2022 9:08 pm MOM shortened to MO makes sense considering all the backlash NJT got when they put forward proposals to run trains through Jamesburg and the like.

I just don’t see it happening. Not yet anyways. Especially with the Hudson River tunnel situation. (T I C K. T O C K. T I C K. T O C K.) Without that you won’t be able to accommodate both the NY bound trains on the NJCL and whatever traffic Lakewood generates. Which would be a lot if it’s setup right.
Ideally, MOM should just be MO, but run Toms River-Lakewood-Freehold-Marlboro-Matawan. That won't happen either though since the bike path that occupies the ROW is pretty popular and goes through numerous very wealthy housing developments - some people would literally end up getting an NJT rail crossing on their driveway.

That being said the population boom that southern/central Monmouth County and northern/central Ocean County has been getting in recent years is insane, and it's even more insane that there's not any sort of commuter rail for them to use.

Plenty of well-used NJT lines don't go directly to NYC, many of them end in Secaucus, Newark, or Hoboken. Even if this proposed MO line just ends up being a shuttle between Lakewood or Toms River and Red Bank, it's a good foundation for the future, people will still use it, and it's better than nothing,
  by CharlieL
 
Please note this caveat to my above comments regarding a possible M-O line:

I can vouch for the guy who told me this. He is to me trustworthy. He is NOT a NJT guy. He either got it from a NJT guy or from someone he trusts who got it from a NJT guy. Hence my "third or fourth hand" comment.

If such does happen, knowing the snail's pace NJT works at, it will not happen in my lifetime, nor in that of a few others on this site.
  by JohnFromJersey
 
A MO(M?) line would be done much faster if a private company, like C&D, handled operations but NJT offered funding, like for public-private-partnerships
  by R&DB
 
JohnFromJersey wrote: Fri Sep 30, 2022 10:05 pm Wait, they were able to traverse from point A to B on this map???
https://imgur.com/a/jyxZ38N
I did not know the tracks were clear enough for that to happen.
John, That track has existed since about 1940 and is just overgrown. It was even double-tracked at one point in time. The original purpose was to give the PRR (the FIT) access to Earle Naval Weapons Station via trackage rights on CNJ from Farmibgdale to Earle.
  by GSC
 
Back in the 1860s, once the Pennsy reached Farmingdale from Jamesburg, PRR had trackage rights on the Southern from Farmingdale north to Eatontown and on to Branchport and Long Branch. Once the NY&LB reached Sea Girt and the Pennsy extended to that point, the Pennsy then had trackage rights ONLY to Long Branch up the NY&LB. (It took threats by PRR to build a parallel line from Long Branch to South Amboy before they obtained rights over the entire NY&LB).
  by Bracdude181
 
@JohnFromJersey No. The track was cleared only enough for Tracks Unlimited to park their equipment without blocking Railroad Ave.

R&DB and GSC, I may be wrong but from looking at the area where brush was cleared I saw what looked like a second track there. Either that or it’s the welded rail Conrail dropped off 30 years ago and never installed.
  by R&DB
 
Bracdude181 wrote: Tue Oct 04, 2022 2:38 pm @JohnFromJersey No. The track was cleared only enough for Tracks Unlimited to park their equipment without blocking Railroad Ave.

R&DB and GSC, I may be wrong but from looking at the area where brush was cleared I saw what looked like a second track there. Either that or it’s the welded rail Conrail dropped off 30 years ago and never installed.
Bracdude,
Cpould well be the rail that CR dropped off there back in the early '90s. I actually watched that delivery. Never knew what they did with it.
  by Bracdude181
 
@R&DB Our mutual acquaintance says the rail was left there and never used.

Speaking of this particular track, I’m being told Tracks Unlimited was putting ties in it today…
  by AWSmith
 
This will be my first post here as I have been watching this thread in my excited anticipation of the FIT being opened up again. I had assumed its juncture with the southern secondary was a "wye" in both north and south directions but I see via Historical imagery that the south leg was actually a diamond that continued on to Manasquan . Any Idea what this El shaped building was at the diamond? A station? a control tower? https://www.historicaerials.com/locatio ... 99/1957/19
  by Wolfgang5150
 
If you go far back Enough on that siding there’s another two or 3 sets of tracks still back there before the buried switch at southard rd. That red building up against the ROW has a very old siding left on its property as well
  by JohnFromJersey
 
Looks like FIT-SOUS connection is finally underway, if they are doing tie work onto that section of track. There were quite a lot of ties in that pile they dropped off.

Going to need a lot of ballast too.

If NJT is really up their arse about this, hopefully FIT-SOUS will be done next summer.

Speaking of the old Pennsy route, Farmingdale-Sea Girt should have never been torn up - that would have been a crucial East-West route that would allow for anything else (like south to Toms River) commuter wise.
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