• CSX to acquire Pan Am Railways

  • Guilford Rail System changed its name to Pan Am Railways in 2006. Discussion relating to the current operations of the Boston & Maine, the Maine Central, and the Springfield Terminal railroads (as well as the Delaware & Hudson while it was under Guilford control until 1988). Official site can be found here: PANAMRAILWAYS.COM.
Guilford Rail System changed its name to Pan Am Railways in 2006. Discussion relating to the current operations of the Boston & Maine, the Maine Central, and the Springfield Terminal railroads (as well as the Delaware & Hudson while it was under Guilford control until 1988). Official site can be found here: PANAMRAILWAYS.COM.

Moderator: MEC407

  • 2446 posts
  • 1
  • 80
  • 81
  • 82
  • 83
  • 84
  • 164
  by F74265A
 
If stb approves the deal, I expect the Worcester route mainline to be rebuilt to 40mph standards to keep transit time between Selkirk and rigby to a minimum. Lots of new rail would be needed I believe.
Presumably the stony brook the same
Worcester route was rebuilt I think to 25 back in early 1990s before it deteriorated again
  by J.D. Lang
 
I still think that there is going to be a lot of pressure to have 2 class I’s provide service to NE. It all depends on what NS is going to do. Maybe they will partner with an investment firm as Ridgefielder suggested a few pages back and buy the CSX portion of PAS. If they did that and if MassDot is pushing for the 2 rail option then MassDot must put their money where their mouth is and give a guarantee that they will help fund the Hoosac Tunnel work and whatever it takes to fully DS D-3 to Ayer. They helped fund the B&A DS project years ago. Whether there would be a Conrail Shared assets type of agreement east of Ayer would be another issue. I think a best case scenario would have NS buy out PAS and have the state help fund the clearance and tunnel issues.

It all depends on what NS is thinking but as time goes on we will see; this story has had a lot of surprises since the sale was announced.
  by Arborwayfan
 
Does CSX abandon the Hoosac Tunnel route because it's redundant and doesn't go to Worcester, or do they shift some freight from the B&A to the Hoosac Tunnel route because it is cheaper to operate over? (It's straighter and less steep, right?) Do they keep serving Maine and NH via that route?

Is the aquisition bad for NE because it pretty much binds the whole region to one rail carrier (routes through Canada are roundabout and lightly maintained, right)? Is it good for NH and ME because they get direct service from a major class I?
  by Shortline614
 
Norfolk Southern has had 50% ownership in all Pan Am lines west of Ayer, Massachusetts (which includes the Hoosac Tunnel) since 2009. It's a joint venture called Pan Am Southern. So any attempt at the abandonment of this route would need approval from Norfolk Southern and the Commonwealth of Massachusetts (they want to keep rail competition in their state). Even if CSX tried to, NS or Mass or both would very quickly step in and buy the route. There is basically a 0% chance that this route will be abandoned. It's simply too important. Maybe not to CSX, but to NS and Mass.

CSX has no real need for this route which is why many speculate that it might get sold to NS as a condition of the merger. If CSX does want to keep the route, one way going about that would be to sell it to Conrail Shared Assets (CRSA is a joint CSX-NS switching railroad in North Jersey, Philly, and Detroit). Remember that railroads are still subject to the Surface Transporation Board (the successor to the ICC).
  by Rockingham Racer
 
Get used to some new symbols on the former B&M and MEC. No more two-letter designations letting folks know origin and destination [if you happen to be familiar with them]. Same thing for locals, I'd guess. "B" this, that and the other.

http://railroadfan.com/wiki/index.php/CSX_Train_Symbols
  by pumpers
 
30 years ago (not as far back as Gilbert!) I lived right next to this ex-Reading line (Not B&O or CNJ, although B&O ran passenger trains to CNJ Communipaw station on it) outside Hopewell NJ, and watched freights like the old Tropicana OJ unit train go by from my kitchen table (when it ran late - usually it was overnight). Back in they day it connected with the Jersey Central just west of Bound Brook, near Manville, to get to Jersey City and the CNJ Communipaw passenger terminal on the NY harbor (Reading and B&O used this). Post Conrail, it now connects at Bound Brook to the former Lehigh Valley (now Conrail) for the run north through the northern NJ metropolitan area. (or you can stay on the Reading to Port Reading Jct and get on the former CNJ for the backdoor to the metro area, but perhaps with lower clearances.) Anyway, my reason for writing is that CSX was working for years to rebuilt or undercut quite a few bridges on the Reading line to improve clearances. Via Conrail in the northern NJ area metro area and then their own ex-Reading line, CSX is now good for double stacks from Selkirk right down to Philly, I think.

Anyway, the big catch is that just south of Philadelphia on CSX (south of Philly to at least Baltimore if not farther is the former B&O), there are some major height restrictions - one may be at Darby where tracks go under a few city blocks . I am nearly certain double stacks, and maybe autoracks, are not allowed. The Howard St tunnel in Baltimore (from the 1800's) is another height restriction, but I read they are finally getting to work on that one. Then it is clear sailing to Florida, I believe .

It might be a while until we see double stacks from Maine to Florida on a single carrier (and I'm not sure why we would), but it's a nice idea to think about. Probably we will see them from the Pacific Ocean to the Atlantic Ocean first (if it hasn't happened in Canada already).
Jim S
The
Gilbert B Norman wrote: Tue Dec 01, 2020 8:58 pm
jamoldover wrote: Tue Dec 01, 2020 6:24 pm ]You've forgotten about CSX's ex-CNJ/B&O line down to Trenton and the Philadelphia area that starts from Bound Brook (at the same junction NS's ex-LV line does). They have no problems getting south from the New York area on their own rails.
... As a kid during the later 40's, I can recall sitting by the tracks at Fanwood near my Aunt's house. Quite the parade of Blue B&O trains, Black and Green striped RDG, and best of all, CNJ Camelbacks.
  by b&m 1566
 
I think having a class 1 will be more beneficial for the shippers, but investing in track upgrades will be key. The Hillsboro Branch I think is a goner, NHDOT is probably going to eat this one against their will, because that line will need to be kept open with the M&B on the other end of it, so maybe M&B expands and takes over the whole branch with interchange done in Nashua. If CSX is really not interested in operating the Line up to Concord, I could see NES taking that over with interchange done right in Nashua or even Lowell, Lowell would be a lot more convenient for CSX. The Portsmouth Branch, is kind of the tricky one, if they don't want that one, my first guess would be NHN (of course that's if they want it), they already have access to Dover and that would be a better interchange spot than Rockingham Jct. plus Dover has room for expansion if needed. Two interchange points would take care of the entire state for CSX, not to shabby if you ask me. I think CSX will keep Boston including Rousselot, there's just to much going on with the commuter rail to throw in another operator.
  by Ridgefielder
 
pumpers wrote: Wed Dec 02, 2020 12:44 pm 30 years ago (not as far back as Gilbert!) I lived right next to this ex-Reading line (Not B&O or CNJ, although B&O ran passenger trains to CNJ Communipaw station on it) outside Hopewell NJ, and watched freights like the old Tropicana OJ unit train go by from my kitchen table (when it ran late - usually it was overnight). Back in they day it connected with the Jersey Central just west of Bound Brook, near Manville, to get to Jersey City and the CNJ Communipaw passenger terminal on the NY harbor (Reading and B&O used this).
As a historical note-- the Reading actually owned a controlling interest in the CNJ from 1901 right up to the end in 1967. And at one point the B&O controlled the Reading, although its not clear to me if that control lasted past the 1930's. Hence the intertwined nature of RDG/CNJ/B&O freight and passenger service in the NY area.
  by NHV 669
 
Why would Boston Sand and Gravel want to haul general freight on a disconnected line from their current ops? More money to tie up in crews and power for minimal cars.
  by Ridgefielder
 
My best guess is that, basically, NS gets the Fitchburg, CSX gets the Maine Central and the Western Route between Boston and Portland, and the remaining bits and pieces of the B&M get parted out to shortline operators.
  by b&m 1566
 
NHV 669 wrote:Why would Boston Sand and Gravel want to haul general freight on a disconnected line from their current ops? More money to tie up in crews and power for minimal cars.
Because they would make the most logical sense given their proximity and because it's a railroad and not Boston Sand and Gravel. I know BS&G owns it but if there's a chance to make a profit from it, why would they turn that down? Anyways, I already questioned whether they would even be interested, because BS&G owns it.
I can't see the Portsmouth Branch being all that appealing to another operator, so maybe CSX works out a deal with NES, they get both the NH main and the Portsmouth Branch through a lease. The lack of interchange space at Rockingham, would still probably lump in Dover.
On another note, does CSX keep the DOBO/BODO or do they hand it over to NHN?
  by F74265A
 
Csx has operated, as I’ve noted elsewhere, light density, poorly maintained lines in NE for decades. See Framingham to Leominster. Yes, they’ve leased away some lines but they’ve kept others. With the valuable propane traffic, I believe they’ll keep Portsmouth branch. As for NS buying out PAS, maybe but they’ve not done so for a decade plus. Suppose csx keeps 1/2 pas, does that really damage NS much so long as STB makes csx keep Ayer as an interchange point and requires csx to play fair dispatching the light traffic on PAS? I kind of think ns would be in much the same position as today
  by eolesen
 
markhb wrote: Tue Dec 01, 2020 7:56 pm
Red Wing wrote:3. It will be sad to see the wreck train and the OCS disposed of.
I'm not sure what the wreck train is, but having had a chance at a walkthrough of the OCS when Amtrak opened the Brunswick Extension, I wonder if CSX might not want to keep at least the cars (with or without the Sisters). It certainly seems sufficiently stylish for at least their mid-level executives to my eyes.
UP kept the best of the CNW business fleet, so perhaps there's some hope there. The sleeper **is** ex-CSX... and they don't currently have a dome.
  by Gilbert B Norman
 
pumpers wrote: Wed Dec 02, 2020 12:44 pm ….. Via Conrail in the northern NJ area metro area and then their own ex-Reading line, CSX is now good for double stacks from Selkirk right down to Philly, I think.
Mr. Jim S (Pumpers; are/were you a Firefighter?), even if still confused how, in that to my knowledge both CNJ and RDG went to the NS resulting from the "Breakup", Chessie can still reach, for the present with single level cars, from Selkirk on the West Shore through New York (thanks to CRSA) to anywhere on her system as a Local shipment (the revenue is all hers; she pays Conrail "whatever").

Finally, IIRC, the "interchange" between the RDG and the B&O at Philly was simply a sign "End B&O begin RDG" somewhat North of B&O's 24th & Market passenger station.
  • 1
  • 80
  • 81
  • 82
  • 83
  • 84
  • 164