CSX Acquisition of Pan Am Railways

Wonder same myself, Mr. Train Guy.

If the US East Coast Longshoremen go out - and are out for any period of time. Montreal, Saint John, and Halifax will be the only Deepwater ports available. No doubt they all will be "busy" and back to the COVID days of "find me a berth; any berth".

Problem of course for Chessie to participate in the flood of traffic is the decrepit Maine Central. Sure Chessie wants an FRA Class 3 (40mph) road handling double stacks and auto racks, but she simply isn't there yet. So, I see no alternative other than ceding the influx of traffic to CN and CPKC

Doublestacks no but the entire MEC mainline between Rigby and Keag is 25 to 40 MPH. Hardly decrepit even with plenty of stick to replace.

I would think if the Canadian ports need to make up for the loss of the US ports then there will be enough carloads to go around. They can't do racks but CSX can just single stack if they can offer a competitive routing to the south.

Glad to learn, Mr. Newpy, that the MEC is not as decrepit as I had been led to believe, but based upon the photos some fellow shared here taken around Keag, it sure looked like FRA "Excepted" (dead slow).

Now so far as the clearance matter, you are much closer to "the action" (even if you have chosen to leave the industry - hey I did after eleven years) than I. If you hold that even handling Containers single stacked, and ceding the Bennies and Bimmers to CPKC and a through Canada routing even if consigned to "The States', Chessie can be in the game, great!!!! And all the more "great" when she can address the MEC clearance issues.

Finally, so far as jointed rail (stick rail in "fanese") goes, it was good enough for 98% of the miles on the MILW (couldn't afford to replace it as the end drew nigh).

Winn to Keag is other than main it's going to be slow at Restricted speed.

Track aside, i doubt short term that any of csx, cpkc or nbsr have crews available for more trains even if more traffic wss theoretically available short term. And the port and cpkc got overwhelmed and backed up last time there was a container surge in saint john

F74265A wrote: ↑Sat Sep 21, 2024 8:30 am Track aside, i doubt short term that any of csx, cpkc or nbsr have crews available for more trains even if more traffic wss theoretically available short term. And the port and cpkc got overwhelmed and backed up last time there was a container surge in saint john

From recent history, I am inclined to think that Saint John is focusing on a "slow and steady wins the race" approach to all the contract issues/opportunities of late. Saint John has been operating on an expected 160 to 200K turnaround this year. If attempting to maybe double that rate(or more), even for a short term, destroys your ability to deliver your existing long term business, it is not good strategy.

There appears to be an equipment related maximum of 200K or so because of cranes, docking, laydown space, rail, etc.,. Those things are all being dealt with, but nothing is going to change in the next week. And nobody appears to be making strategic decisions based on unpredictable short term situations.

Whatever happens, it is likely not going to last long. It's results will be felt long after all the contracts are signed, so even putting a few extra containers through is not going to change much.

One thing that hasn't been mentioned is how much the union will be involved here. Saint John has been ILA local 273 since 1911. Maybe nothing officially, but I wouldn't assume anything unofficially.

I’m sure many of you guys know that the line off of Rockingham Jct (Portsmouth branch), had a fire at the trestle that crosses the over southern part of Great Bay. Does anyone have any intel on status? Do they plan to just rebuild with wooden beams or add a steel structure?

The bridge fire is being discussed in the Portsmouth Branch thread, which you can find here:

https://railroad.net/portsmouth-branch-activity-t84166-1680.html#p1656837

Over at the CPKC Forum, there has been discussion how the Port of Saint John has greatly increased its callings - and apparently at the expense of both Halifax and Montreal. Montreal is simply "on its way out of the game" as 23K TEU becomes the standard for container vessels. As I noted over at that Forum, I did get to do some "St. Lawrence River viewing" flying BER to EWR last October, and I certainly did not see from my window seat (paid dearly extra for it) any vessel that size.

Have we any reports yet how much of the increased traffic arising from these Saint John callings has found their way to Chessie, or does she simply need to get the MEC in better shape "to play"?

A corollary is to what extent has Mr. Irving got his two roads, namely the US and Canadian, in shape to handle the traffic Saint John-Keag; I assume, but have no confirmation that rates are being made for such routing. It certainly would be in the interest to both roads to make such rates.

At least via Mattawamkeag, there is no intermodal interchange between CP/Irving and CSX. Not sure of other interchange points. CSX still has a lot of clearance work to do on the former Pan Am, and most of that work has been focused on Worcester to Ayer MA so far.

I believe there is presently only one combined intermodal/manifest train in each direction daily between Montreal/Brownville Jct/Saint John via the former International Of Maine Division, with frequent musings about more, subject to availability of train crews and power to run them.

It seems to me that if Saint John wants to get in the game with containers (maybe even autos) consigned to the inland Southeast, Chessie will need to get the MEC fixed up (and get Mr. Irving to make rates with her through Keag, if he doesn't do so already).

Somehow, I think she knows that - and so does the Port.

I would think with three frontiers to X, CPKC would be at a distinct disadvantage, and CN, even with only two frontier X-ings. Further, both roads would have to interchange with Chessie or Topper for delivery.

So I would think if the Port hopes to be in the game for such traffic to/from the Southeast,, they will have to look to Chessie - or God forbid, highways.

Montreal is simply "on its way out of the game" as 23K TEU becomes the standard for container vessels.

Hardly, Mr. Norman... and if they are, someone better tell them so they can stop work on the nearly $1B (cdn), 1M+ TEU container capacity expansion in Contrecoeur.

Also, the 23K TEU vessel is not, and will not become "the standard" [size]. While the megaships grab the headlines, average containership capacity is below 5,000 TEU and the current average build is in the neighborhood of 7-8,000 TEU.

I'll also respectfully take issue with the idea of moving U.S. import freight destined for the Southeast through the port of Saint John (or any Canadian port, for that matter). Between Savannah, Charleston and, to a lesser degree, Norfolk, Jacksonville (and keep an eye on Mobile), oh, and port-sponsored inland terminals (Greer, App Regional, Dillon, etc)... making the economics work on a 1,500-2,000-mile rail haul would be a tall order, indeed.

Mr. Cowford, I'm pleased to note you have chosen to become more active of late around here, and will respectfully defer to your knowledge of maritime industry affairs.

Simply because I read newspapers about the 23K TEU vessels - and even the m/v Dali is only in the 10K range - does not mean such has become the standard - even if papers like the Journal and The Times had me believing such.

I guess the reported pilotage requirement from Quebec and Westward is not a deterrent to Montreal callings.

So thank you for stepping up; all I can say is with your participation around here, I learn.

Mr. Cowford, a further note; I guess if a 23K TEU vessels was sailing "up the Saint Lawrence and back to Gaspe'" when I had my little "flightseeing episode" I've reported around here, even six miles up, I would have noted it.

By the way, it was reported here (I think at the Saint John topic) that Mediterranean Shipping Company did sail a 20K TEU vessel up to Montreal. But apparently it was a "stunt" as the vessel was only part loaded.

No that never happened with a 20K TEU ship to Montreal. They can take light loaded 7000 TEU ships and that happened once as a "look what we can do" ploy.