Conway Scenic Railroad (CSRX) discussion thread

[Jonathan]

That's good because, working at Conway for me, is the end goal, honestly. I get everything there is trending down right now, and though I feel some hopelessness about the future, that's not to say that it won't get better. Yes, the 50th anniversary is a let down, the climate there now is toxic, from what I read here. Who's to say in, say, 5-10 years, a new owner comes in and starts to get the railroad back to what it used to be?

And, as I was working on this post, the news of the photo freight came out. Did anyone catch the lead up? "Among the other special treats we are planning....." there's more than the photo freight, that's what I think.

[MEC407]

how many people from this generation want a job on a railroad? I can speak from experience: at 23, i am the youngest volunteer at the trolley museum i'm a member of and right now, we're having trouble getting new volunteers. How are we going to get young people excited and interested in working to preserve a heritage railroad moving forward?

Lots of young people want to work for railroads. Amtrak has some very young guys (early to mid 20s) working as conductors and assistant conductors on the Downeaster right now, for example. They love their jobs, and the ones I know are planning to stay in railroading for life.

The critical difference is that Amtrak pays a living wage. Conway Scenic doesn't.

Young people are in a very difficult position right now, especially if they're hoping to leave their parents' homes. Rent prices in New England are horribly high, even in the cities and towns that historically were very affordable. I know a lot of 20-somethings and 30-somethings who are working 60, 70, 80 hours a week just to pay the rent. Most of them would love to spend a few days a month volunteering for something they're passionate about, but they simply don't have the time.

[CPF66]

Conway's benefits are also likely low or non-existent and I am guessing they don't have a retirement plan. Why work for Conway Scenic when railroads like NHN and CSX start at around $25.00 and railroads like Amtrak and NBM Railways start at $40.00+.

[b&m 1566]

What is Conway's pay scale and benefits like and how does it compare in relation to Granite State & the Cog? What about on a national scale comparing them to other for profit heritage operations?

[OldColony]

The "everyone is leaving the hobby" mentality has been around from decades. There are plenty of people willing to make a career out of a hobby, and Conway produced 20+ people I can think of who went on to other railroads. But the key detail was they had a training pipeline in place. New guys were trained by people who had been there 5-10 years. Those guys were trained and supervised by either retired railroaders, or people who had been in the game for decades. And those guys were managed by a OPM who was being trained by the GM and the process worked great...

...I think you will find the hobby is the biggest its ever been since probably the 50's. Some places do outreach better than others. WW&F is great at recruiting the younger generation as have several other tourist lines in New England...

Spot on.

Lots of young people want to work for railroads. Amtrak has some very young guys (early to mid 20s) working as conductors and assistant conductors on the Downeaster right now, for example. They love their jobs, and the ones I know are planning to stay in railroading for life.

Also spot on. I've witnessed both observations this past decade+.

[CSRR573]

Lots of young people want to work for railroads. Amtrak has some very young guys (early to mid 20s) working as conductors and assistant conductors on the Downeaster right now, for example. They love their jobs, and the ones I know are planning to stay in railroading for life.

I second this. You should see how many 20-29 years olds work here at Southampton. Id say theyre starting to outnumber the old heads

[Who]

What is Conway's pay scale and benefits like and how does it compare in relation to Granite State & the Cog? What about on a national scale comparing them to other for profit heritage operations?

It's a bashing session against Dave, they are not interested in comparing numbers. I would suspect it's probably not much different now than when Russ owned the railroad and it's probably very similar to the others.

[CPF66]

I am not sure what the current pay situation is at Conway, but I know people who work at Granite State and the Cog so I will follow up with them to see what pay is like. Last I knew Conway Scenic was starting at $15.00 which is extremely low for the cost of living in that area.

[b&m 1566]

Mr. Costello (or should I call you Abbott), my questions were rhetorical but thanks for proving my point.
I won't argue against anyone's personal opinion, everyone is entitled to their own, but when people start throwing around "facts" with nothing to show, that gets annoying.

[CPF66]

FWIW, tourist railroads are always going to pay less and not have railroad retirement, which is going to keep many people from staying there long term. However, cost of living comes into play and when fast food chains offer the same level of pay as the railroad, obviously they are going to have a hard time hiring or retaining employees.

[MEC407]

Agreed, and this is why retired railroaders often work part-time or seasonally at tourist railroads and museum railroads. This gives the outward appearance that young people aren't interested in working there, but it's just that: an appearance. The old heads can afford to work part time for low wages (or volunteer for free) because their homes are paid off, they've already got benefits, pensions, savings, etc.

[b&m 1566]

Of course heritage railroads are going to pay less, they always have and always will, they don't have the same level of income compared to freight railroads or even Amtrak and all the commuter operations with government subsidies. Heritage operations are a good starting point or ending point, if one chooses to make a career working at one so be it, that's their choice.

[CN9634]

It's easy to be a critic when you aren't involved. I notice at least one poster here who is always critical but never willing to work or volunteer for the outfit. I've done some volunteering as life permits and been extremely grateful for the experience, but also the fact the railroad simply exists. Those who wish to be critical can only do so because people have continually over the years kept the rails polished.

My advice is to support the railroad, the railroaders, and other associated folks by simply going and paying for a train ride. Otherwise if you aren't doing that then go find something else to obsess over.

[CPF66]

Agree to disagree. Its one thing to take a critical perspective over a set of facts, but its another thing to discuss a well documented set of facts. Some people are unable to support organizations due to financial constraints or geographical locations. But that's not to say the input or concerns they bring up aren't valid. If only those who currently work there, or spend money there are the ones who can make comments about the railroad, than that nullifies the entire purpose of this site.
Additionally, everyone here including myself who have commented here have given their pound of flesh, either by paying for rides during the railroads 50 years, working there, or helping in other ways. So your last statement is redundant.

It's easy to be a critic when you aren't involved. I notice at least one poster here who is always critical but never willing to work or volunteer for the outfit.

Interesting that you can be so certain that individuals here have never worked or volunteered for the railroad...

At the end of the day, any criticism being brought fourth by anyone isn't directed at the railroad or the employees. The railroad has been near and dear to hundreds if not more people, to many its a shame to see what is happening to the place. As for the employees, they are just doing what the owners tell them and you cannot knock them for that. That being said its the upper management and owners being criticized and so far its been for primarily valid reasons.

[Westbound31]

CPF66 is spot on again. I worked for Conway Scenic. There's a reason why all the employees either left or were fired. The guy can't take a single ounce of constructive criticism. Hell, most of the time it wasn't even criticism. When you have a genuine safety concern, you should be able to talk about that with management without being targeted. The guy can do no wrong in his own eyes. That's why 216 rolled down to the bottom of the hill completely unmanned and swirk backed the new dome car into the historic roundhouse. It's a joke. We worked for men who 1, cared about the railroad AND the railfans, 2, were experienced railroaders themselves and 3, put safety as a top priority of operations. The pre-swirk Conway Scenic was a different place, it was very well run railroad. Defend him all you want but as someone who worked there with intimate knowledge of the things that happened and the reasons the experienced guys left, I'll choose to stay on this ship. If the guy can just open up to listening to others and release an ounce of power to someone else who knows better, things can easily turn around. A railroad is not a one man show, its not a one man operation yet that's how swirk treats it. He took over and little by little took more and more from the experienced guys until they all either left or were fired and hasn't released one bit back. And that's why we're where we are today. We all still keep in touch and the experienced guys are on different railroads doing great things. We would have been doing those same things at Conway still had swirk allowed it.