Can Biodiesel be a Locomotive Fuel?

I was wondering because up here in Seattle, the Washington State Ferries is begining to use a fuel of 5% Biodiesel and 95% Petroleum Diesel in the boats, and that has given King County Metro, the largest bus operator in the state, the idea of converting all 1200 Diesel Transit Buses in it's fleet to use B5.

Can a locomotive like the F59PHI use B5, so that SOUND TRANSIT and Amtrak Cascades could reduce their emissions? I mean, will it affect train performance?

Yes, locomotives can use biodiesel. A very mild blend, such as B5, wouldn't require any modifications. B10 would probably be fine too. A stronger blend, such as B20, might require some modifications, especially in cold weather climates. But yes, it's definitely doable. I live in Maine and know a few Volkswagen Diesel owners who run B20 in their cars with no modifications and no problems. I've also heard of a local guy with an old Volvo Diesel who burns pure B100 in it. The tank has a heater to keep the oil from getting too thick in cold weather.

MEC407 wrote:Yes, locomotives can use biodiesel. A very mild blend, such as B5, wouldn't require any modifications. B10 would probably be fine too. A stronger blend, such as B20, might require some modifications, especially in cold weather climates. But yes, it's definitely doable. I live in Maine and know a few Volkswagen Diesel owners who run B20 in their cars with no modifications and no problems. I've also heard of a local guy with an old Volvo Diesel who burns pure B100 in it. The tank has a heater to keep the oil from getting too thick in cold weather.

Good, it will be an even better incentive for Sound Transit and Amtrak Cascades to show that they are even better at reducing emissons. That and maybe get a Green Goat or two for switching duties in the yard.

The only possible problem I see is if the locomotives are still under warranty from the manufacturer... EMD or GE or whoever built the locomotive might say "if you use anything other than conventional diesel, the warranty is void." If these are older locomotives that are no longer under warranty, it shouldn't be an issue.

I believe that there were incentives fo the manufacturers to use Bio-Fuels for the Teir-,0,1,2 compliances. Bio, or Soy Diesel already burns cleaner than standard diesel.

Your standard, run-of-the-mill diesel will burn just about anything combustable, bio or whatever, even coal dust. Some automobile diesels run on used vegetable oil. Army multifuel engines in the M-35 series trucks ran on diesel, or gasoline. Suck, squeeze, bang, blow - that's a diesel.

It was recently announced that Minnesota Prairie RR - a shortline operated by Twin Cities & Western and based in Morton, MN will be using some bio-diesel.

dhaugh wrote:It was recently announced that Minnesota Prairie RR - a shortline operated by Twin Cities & Western and based in Morton, MN will be using some bio-diesel.

I would like the stuff to be used in F59s, so all transit in Seattle will be close to Enviromentally Friendly. Let's exceed the new Diesel Standards instead of just meeting them.

Personally, I miss Alco locomotives. With the turbo lag, you had black smoke that let you know what was under the hood. As for being "environmentally friendly," I do believe Mount Hood will solve that problem in the foreseeable future.

Speaking of ALCO, just as a testament to ALCO's quality design, the 251 engine is still in production by Fairbanks-Morse, in the 18 cyl version they have it producing OVER 4,000 HP. F-M says that the 251 can even be made Tier II compliant. And this is an engine designed is 1951! Pretty remarkable if you ask me.

Statkowski wrote:Your standard, run-of-the-mill diesel will burn just about anything combustable, bio or whatever, even coal dust. Some automobile diesels run on used vegetable oil. Army multifuel engines in the M-35 series trucks ran on diesel, or gasoline. Suck, squeeze, bang, blow - that's a diesel.

Funny you mention coal dust...because that is one of the alternate fuels that Rudolf Diesel intended to be used in his engine. Foresighted, that man was...he certainly pushed for the use of vegetable oil as a fuel source, having in mind a fuel source that was renewable and didn't require digging wells in the ground or the sea bed.

Irish Chieftain wrote: Funny you mention coal dust...because that is one of the alternate fuels that Rudolf Diesel intended to be used in his engine. Foresighted, that man was...he certainly pushed for the use of vegetable oil as a fuel source, having in mind a fuel source that was renewable and didn't require digging wells in the ground or the sea bed.

I hope that EMD and GE can get cracking on making the SD70M-2, SD70ACe, and the Evolution series running on these alternative fuels.

Biodiesel can be a locomotive fuel, no mods to the prime movers are needed... heck even old SD40-2's and Geeps can be run on it without no fuel system work whatsoever... this semester I am taking Alternative Fuels in school, I might ask the instructor about it next week.

Although there may be a bad side to it, as the "french fry" scent of the exhaust (yes, that's what the exhaust smells like!) will make the crews hungry and want to stop the train at every McDonald's along the route...lol.

BTW, Diesel originally designed his engine to run on peanut oil, so maybe vegetable oil could be used also.

emd_SD_60 wrote:
BTW, Diesel originally designed his engine to run on peanut oil, so maybe vegetable oil could be used also.

It's about time that Diesel goes retro!

b20 would be no problem.

b100 would be ok too with some minor mods [rubber fuel lines designed to deal with alcohol that is in biodiesel]. that would be great down south somewhere where it is warm all the time. up my way, it won't work so well as we can get below -40 at times...