B&M / NYC pool power?

I feel sure I recall seeing PC power on B&M trains around Greenfield and Deerfield, when I was a kid in the late 60s - early 70s.
were these pooled power, or leased units?
and
did such occur prior to PC - could one see NYC and B&M power mixed consists into E.Deerfield, and if so , did they go east of Deerfield?

B&M and PC pooled power on the coal train, B&M even losing a unit in a wreck in Ohio, assuming memory is accurate. Some non-repainted NYC units may well have been part of the coal train pool mix. If memory is again accurate, Jim Shaughnessy had a photo in Trains of The New England States with NYC power exiting the Hoosac during a hurricane-caused detour, perhaps in the 50s.
Non-coal-train pooling seems unlikely given the competition that then existed.

the coal trains to Bow NH, very good. thanks.

The New England states did indeed use the B&M for a week or so as a result of a storm in 53, there are pictures of it departing North Station in Trackside Around Boston with Lawson Hill.

The New England States also detoured over the B&M in 1955 when several large portions of B&A track were washed out by floods.

so , who knows of some pics of B&M geeps or RS-3's MUed with NYC power?

It wasn't just the coal train that brought NYC/PC power into East Deerfield. For a few years around 1970s, in order to speed up interchange through Rotterdam Junction, the B&M and PC ran a daily East Deerfield-DeWitt (Syracuse) freight with runthrough power. Ex-NYC F7s were common on this job for a while, which was really neat. The PC power on these trains did not normally run east of East Deerfield.

As noted above, from the mid-1960s onward there was also the Bow coal train with mostly NYC/PC power and some B&M Geeps that ran through to the mine in Pennsylvania via Ashtabula, Ohio (where a couple got wrecked in a runaway accident) and the Pittsburgh & Lake Erie. I never saw a B&M RS3 on the coal train, just GP9s and GP18s.

Another late-1960s power pool was on Boston-Chicago piggyback trains PB-99/PB-100 via the B&M/D&H/EL route, which brought D&H and El power into Boston and B&M Geeps to Chicago.

I believe the pooled PC power was on symbol freights BM-17 and NY-20 and I believe it ran DeWitt-E. Deerfield. The units lost in the coal train runaway wreck in 1968 at Ashtabula, Ohio were B & M 1710 and 1735. EL, D & H and B & M units ran in a run through arrangement on PB 99 and PB 100 between Boston and Chicago. Each road's contribution was based on distance and size of motive power. EL units usually covered two trips a week and D & H one. B & M three.

BM-17 and NY-20 ran from Rotterdam Jct. to Rigby, you're thinking of BM-7 and NY-10 that ran into East Deerfield. When I was a locomotive dispatcher early in my career with the B&M, I was always told to make sure that our GP-38-2's did not go on these trains as the Penn Central was sure to hijack them and use them to get back at us for doing the same thing. That is why both RR's used older 1st generation power, because both RR's were guilty of using each others power for uses other than the intended route.

I'm surprised that CSX doesn't do the same thing... you'd think that instead of sending new EVOs and ACEs to Rigby, they'd send some ratty old SD40s or something, considering the junk PAR sends them to pay back HP hours.

MEC407 wrote:I'm surprised that CSX doesn't do the same thing... you'd think that instead of sending new EVOs and ACEs to Rigby, they'd send some ratty old SD40s or something, considering the junk PAR sends them to pay back HP hours.

You and me both, I think the only thing that prevents Pan Am from the temptation, is the fact that CSX has the ability to track their power through GPS.

Many of the photos of coal trains shows the B&M unit leading. I recall reading that cab signals were still in use. Wasn't the system deactivated in sections?

I can't give you a full history of cab signals on the B&M, but during the 1950s and through the mid-1960s time frame when the interline Bow coal trains started up, cab signals were in service on the Fitchburg Division mainline between West Cambridge and East Deerfield. Rules required that a B&M unit with cab signal gear lead all road freights in that territory, although some local freights and special moves were exempted. The cab signal system was discontinued by about 1970, after which PC or other foreign units could lead.

I believe that by the mid-1960s (after passenger service to Fitchburg ended), cab signaling was only in effect between between Boston and Ayer. ETTs contained a rule which allowed a non-equipped engine, or an engine with non-functional cab signal equipment to operate if an absolute block was established ahead of it. This was originally to allow non-equipped switchers to operate between Boston and West Cambridge or Waltham, but I expect it also applied to pool power. I saw EL and D&H engines in the Boston area during that era, but NYC/PC only appeared on the Bow coal train AFAIK.