At The Throttle With Your Manager Onboard

I've sort of brought this up before, but do you guys run the same with the MOP onboard like you would any other day? Or is it sweaty palms the whole time? And the other thing I was wondering is what goes through the MOP's mind when they ride with a problem hog head who then is on his best behavior when he's going for a ride. Do they get a chuckle out of it, or does it get upsetting that they don't always do their best out there? LCJ?...... I know there's a couple more out there that have looked after hogheads. What's that like for a manager?

I don't like anxiety, so I do what I do everyday regardless, plus they pull my tape so they already know all my bad habits and my style of running. The way I view "a ride", is that they're with me to see how I handle the situations that may come up instead of "testing" me on the rules, not to say that I haven't gotten a talking to about something before, but it wasn't the real point of the ride.

I've had a couple conductors who have tryed to MOP me in deciding what's best which never makes me happy, an ill decide, plug me then, you scared, I gotter, or just a no, is how I reply to there suggestion. I'm not one of thoses hoghead switchman telling them what to do, so I expect the same when its my turn to do some work. One thing alot of hogs do here in my district, they start slowing down as soon as they see the flasher. So then when I'm in the chair doing 70mph, I don't notch off till I have acknowledged the cab signal. So conductors look at me like I've broken the rules or that I'm out of control. It's perfectly legal/safe to run like that in warm weather, good train & power, they just don't trust me. Showing some concern is one thing, telling me what to do or to slow down is another.

Well, I'm a conductor and not a hogger, but I know what you mean. I always try to work safe and efficient, so I really don't give a crap if a boss is on the train. The only thing I don't like about it is that I can't take a nap when we are stuck waiting for rr. Oh, and I stop mooning passing crews too.
-r

1

Yes they hide/test us alot, no getting on or off moving equipment. In the yard we would "give a signal" if we saw a trainmaster sneaking around, "the ducks are flying low", or "sniper in the weeds", stuff like that.

90% of the time, well maybe 40% now, my manager gets pretty upset on a ride. When i had my first ride with my MOP as a student engineer, about two or three months in, i thought i would show him how good i was at "grandstanding" at the switch to head up the branch. I stopped right at the switch just like i planned, i was happy, but when i looked over his face it was lobster red. I dont know if he was mad cuzz i was running like that soo early into my training, or if he just didnt like the idea of showing off.

The rest of the stuff i do that gets me in trouble: light power braking/heavy power braking for a short distance, not blowing the horn, not repeating car counts over the radio, had flat spots one time didnt slow down and or stop to inspect them, not stopping in half the distance of the last car count given while pinning off cars, speeding in the yard, asking the MOP if he wanted me to haul ass with the goat to show him the bad spots in the yard. If thats as bad as its gonna get, im ok with it. I get along good with all the managers/MOP's ive had.

No getting on/off moving equipment? sheesh

Oh yeah, the big roads are all into that now, and have been for several years. There have been serious incidents which happened when something started moving and new employees had never been taught how to get on. So the equipment just kept rolling until too late.

I don't know about UP's radio rules, but most rulebooks used to require that specific instructions were to be repeated with some exceptions, one of which was while switching in a yard. In other words you did not have to repeat it every time somebody gave you a car count. It can drive you nuts having to respond to that all day long, and constantly reaching for the radio to acknowledge a car count can interfere with your other motions.

Safety is a great thing but some of the big roads respond to every injury with a rule or program to eliminate it. They are working toward the day when there will be no crew on the trains and everything is done by someone in a tower and a remote control, like a big Lionel set. Zero injuries to train crews because there are zero train crews.

UPRR engineer wrote:Yes they hide/test us alot, no getting on or off moving equipment. In the yard we would "give a signal" if we saw a trainmaster sneaking around, "the ducks are flying low", or "sniper in the weeds", stuff like that.

I have to admit I used to enjoy being the one "sneaking" around watching what crews did. It was/is an important part of the job of a railroad manager -- as required by law -- to be performed at a certain level.

The guys I teamed up with most often were really not out to get people. We usually just watched what crews did in response to normal situations. Sometimes we had to set signals because there was no other way to test for an approach or stop indication compliance. On a good night everyone did what they should have been doing, and we would let them know we had seen it.

As professionals, most of the crews understood they had a duty to stay within the operating guidelines. They understood the importance of signal compliance.

After the extremely unpleasant experience of having a major accident in my territory, I found out very quickly how my prior field testing levels came to the forefront. If I had not been doing that part of my job well, there would have been hell to pay for me, my boss, and his boss. That's just the way it works.

When you are up on the witness stand for an NTSB public hearing (under oath), that's one of the first thing they want to explore for the record.

For my last 2 years on Conrail, I was an assigned engineer, on the OCS train, with my counterpart, from Philly, taking the west and south trains, and myself running east and north. Every trip had "brass in the cab", and highly polished brass in the coaches. I ran the same, IRREGARDLESS of who was in the cab, or coaches. My ability to run correctly, safely and "quickly" landed me this position, along with my "like" of the 24 brake. The Road Foreman never ran, nor did any other official. It was my baby, and it didn't matter who was on board. It would take a person with a serious lack of confidence, to be "shaken" by the presence of his boss, on the train. As long as your train handling skills are on the money, and you abide by the big rules, it would take a real chickens*@t manager to sweat you over some trivial item. Most "bosses" get a truly undeserved bad rap, by someone who was previously (and most likely RIGHTLY criticized, for some rules infractions) called upon the carpet. The bosses are like the rest of us, they want to do their job, not get a lot of grief from their boss, and go home at the end of the day, in one piece. If your MOP or RFE makes you "nervous" in the cab, perhaps it's because you are unsure of your own skills, in the seat ? just a thought. Regards

GOLDEN-ARM wrote: I ran the same, IRREGARDLESS (I got that....i figured LCJ would have said something by now lol) of who was in the cab, or coaches. My ability to run correctly, safely and "quickly" landed me this position.
Most "bosses" get a truly undeserved bad rap, by someone who was previously (and most likely RIGHTLY criticized, for some rules infractions) called upon the carpet. If your MOP or RFE makes you "nervous" in the cab, perhaps it's because you are unsure of your own skills, in the seat ? just a thought. Regards

The only problem i seem to get is when i get a new MOP who has a different view on running a train vs. the old one i had. My first RFE was around the same age as you Golden Arm im guessing. He knew that a little to medium power braking was ok for the sake of train handling to get over the road quickly regardless of what the boys in Omaha say. On my last ride with my new boss we were dogcatching a heavy long double stack, pretty flat exept for dropping off one hill out there which leaves a guy two choices. Bomb off the hill, bunch them up with dynamics for about 2 miles only to stretch them out again at the bottom, or set initial to ten pounds, pull them all the way down, and kicker off at the bottom. Well me having the old head attitude, if your gonna drag a train DRAG IT, shove a train SHOVE IT. I decided on using the air to keep it stretched. 1/4 of the train over the hill intial, notch down to the 6th run, 1/2 over ten pounds putter back in the 8th run. We gotter going over 70mph for a bit, but you could have had a glass of water on the drawbar of the rear car and not spilled a drop. We had a talk about power braking and how "they" dont like that but he also said good job on train handling, could be someones Dell computer in that last container, theres no caboose on the rear now a days, and so on. Which one do you make happy, the railroad, customer, yourself for having some pride in what you do? As you said, My ability to run correctly, safely and "quickly" The railroads are goofy like that. Im not saying anything bad about my MOP he is just doing what he is told, to make his boss happy and what not like you said Golden Arm. He's a good guy and a good freind. When the conductor told us where we were going i knew that when we hit that spot he was gonna speak up, i too run the way i see fit, irregardless of who is in the cab, but im trying to better my skills to please him. Maybe next time im running a double stack/auto train ill try not to approach the hill so hard, coast longer, set intial twards the bottom (which will hopefully stretch the train a bit), kick the air off and then start working it back up to the 8th run. Im sure the needle will be touching the speed-O-meter close to 75 at the bottom, but at least it will be a smooth ride. I couldnt call myself a master hoghead yet, but im working at it.

Your right on the money about managers tho Mr. Arm, one good ripping/talkin to because an employee wasnt doing there job, and all they do bad mouth the guy forever. Its about the same way criminals think about the police/laws. Im not that way, ive had a couple managers/yardmasters hold a grudge against me, and they wait till i mess up and let me have it. Me walking down the carpet with a smile on my face takes all the sport out of the hunt.

The UP has a point system, we all start out with a thousand. My MOP says im the only guy who doesnt get upset when he takes some points away and knocks my score down. "reach in the old point bag and pull yourself out a few" I've even went as far as telling them to put me down for a failure on something cheezy like not saying over and out or something. I tell them you cant be too nice or they will run you off. I enjoy coming to work so none of that stuff gets to me, i like my managers as much as my co-workers.

Golden Arm, LCJ, you guys ever managed a hoghead that had the same attitude that i have? You love them, but you hate them the same?

And Golden Arm buddy, why would a master engineer such as yourself have "UPHILL SLOW, DOWNHILL FAST- TONNAGE FIRST, SAFETY LAST" at the bottom of every post? You dont like to run "The Rocket" trains? I love to run the heavy coal/soad ash trains as much as i do the "shooters". Just wondering whats behind that buddy.

UPRR engineer wrote:...you guys ever managed a hoghead that had the same attitude that i have? You love them, but you hate them the same?

While you seem to be truly unique in many ways, I believe I may have had some with attitudes similar to yours. I can't say I ever hated them, though...but I guess I didn't love them either!

Those who showed me respect usually got mine. I got the most nervous about those who obviously were changing their mode of operation when I was on board.

So -- how many points do you have now (if you don't mind my asking)?

UPRR engineer wrote:Golden Arm, LCJ, you guys ever managed a hoghead that had the same attitude that i have? You love them, but you hate them the same?

And Golden Arm buddy, why would a master engineer such as yourself have "UPHILL SLOW, DOWNHILL FAST- TONNAGE FIRST, SAFETY LAST" at the bottom of every post? You dont like to run "The Rocket" trains? I love to run the heavy coal/soad ash trains as much as i do the "shooters". Just wondering whats behind that buddy.

You're totally in the dark re: Golden Arm's adage. It's a slam on railroads and their supposed interest in safety. By the way, in reference to another recent post of yours, I know condrs. knocking down $5,000.00/half. You're not setting any industry records by any means.

jg greenwood wrote: You're totally in the dark re: Golden Arm's adage. It's a slam on railroads and their supposed interest in safety. By the way, in reference to another recent post of yours, I know condrs. knocking down $5,000.00/half. You're not setting any industry records by any means.

I thought me and you were compairing buddy You dont think ive passed the five grand point on my tie ups, more than that, i was being nice when i said i fell a couple hundered short. (with out trying to brag too much)-----> conductor pilot.....selective service..... I was trying real hard that half to beat those halfs, but i failed. If the drinks were on me for steelwheels, LCJ, slchub, and steam for the half i posted, back then as a pilot, everyone on here would have been drinking on me.

I had to work hard to make that money last half. Its alot easier to make that kind of money when the board spins even faster, sleep, eat, work. I was kinda unlike my normal self, shy about it when i posted it because of how much it is. Its hard to find anyone who is as open about stuff as i am on here, SO BE NICE!!!!..... lol just kidding i like to see what people think good or bad. Green River is a cool place to work for the UP.

If anyone needs me to explain selective service just ask, ill tell you.

LCJ wrote: While you seem to be truly unique in many ways, I believe I may have had some with attitudes similar to yours. I can't say I ever hated them, though...but I guess I didn't love them either!

I got the most nervous about those who obviously were changing their mode of operation when I was on board.

So -- how many points do you have now (if you don't mind my asking)?

You crack me up buddy, you see where they got mad at you for asking me what i was smokin on the Amtrak forum? -laughs-

I kinda like how i get treated, its just about right. Its like having a son who you love to do stuff with, camping, fishing, hobbies, which is like me working, i do good work, get DP trains unquailified, switch alot of cars and what not, but then sometimes your son burns the tent down, wrecks your truck, loses your pole in the lake, eats all your favorite chips which is like me power braking a little, kicks cars too hard and derails, mouthing off to the tower, stuff like that. Love to hate me.

I'll tell you anything you wanna know LCJ, think last time he looked i was at 930, 920.....low 900's. At 850 they have to pay more attention to you, more rides, one every 2 months i think, 3 months maybe, more testing, more one on one talks. I havent failed any tests, shoved/kicked cars out the other end a few too many times doing RCL and they decided id better get punished a little bit, Act 2 for that i think, that knocked some points. Got a behavior mode which is a level 3 that turned into a slap on the wrist for doing it the first time (five and you fired for good for those who dont know) that took a good chunk out. Got that when i parked the goat, tied up and left the property with out asking the tower if i was done. Ya..... -laughs again-.... it wasnt all my fault, its a long story, ill tell it sometime. Im under "coaching" for not blowing the horn as much as i should, maybe i got an Act 2 for that also, i think so. Theres some more points lost. Probably under "coaching" for power braking also now, ill have to see when i do a one on one later this year.