Railroad Forums 

Discussion relating to the past and present operations of the NYC Subway, PATH, and Staten Island Railway (SIRT).

Moderator: GirlOnTheTrain

 #91429  by UpperHarlemLine4ever
 
Ratgallery, I don't know what happened to you in Grand Central Terminal and what led to your detention. The police have been quite on edge here in New York for quite some time. As a German-American and a retired law enforcement officer (part of my career having been spent as an Eisenbahn Polizist [RR Police Officer]) I can tell you that everyone is treated the same by the police. I have stopped photographing because of the hasseling that I have received both when I was still "on the job" and since I have retired. It's not worth the effort. Not having been back to Germany in quite a few years, I don't know how things are over there right now. I do know that the last time I visited when I identified myself as a law enforcement officer from the US, you would think a visiting dignitary had come home. Please don't take it personally. Endschuldigen sie mir bitte. Perhaps if you go to the MTA police when you arrive at Grand Central and tell them of your intentions, they will assist you.
Last edited by UpperHarlemLine4ever on Sat Jan 29, 2005 1:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.

 #92488  by RailBus63
 
Those of us who have been photographing transit subjects for a few years quickly learn that three items are typically forbidden: flash and photoflood units (because they can temporarily blind transit employees and passengers) and tripods (because they could become a tripping hazard). In fairness to our German visitor here, though, that information is generally not posted in public areas and I'll guess that many employees aren't familiar with the rules either (most mistakenly think that photography is illegal).

That said, I've been confronted about photography on a few occasions, but never threatened with arrest. Most of the time, the officer or employee insist that I stop and simply go on my way. If I have a permit (for example, on the MBTA in Boston), I will show that person the permit and usually they go away satisfied. If I do not have a permit, and the persons insists that I cannot continue my photography, then I stop and move on to another location. I don't believe it's wise to stand there and argue with that person and let the situation escalate - in most cases, my time available for photography is limited and I'd rather not spend it in a police station.

JD
 #93231  by Robert Paniagua
 
I'd rather not spend it in a police station.

Not only that, but you would end up with a criminal past as well. That arrest would appar on your warrant status as a past arrest, and could end up "ruining your future" for life. That's it since that arrest stays there for the remainder of your natural life and you'll live with it.

That's why we all should comply with officers and move on.

 #94357  by rAtGallery
 
Thank you for all your comments, guys. Well, more to the reasonable ones than to the ones accusing me of misbehavior.

The general fear of terrorism seems to bring out strange behaviour and some weird perspectives. Like someone mentioned above, the authorities control peope taking photographs -- and when a permit has been issued they walk away and let you do your job. I've experienced similar situations.

So taking pictures is dangerous for bypassers until one shows a permit? I don't get the point. If a permit is issued without ANY control of who one is (and exactly this happened to me) what is the use of that permission process? They're only producing paper instead of having a few signs saying: "No photography allowed during peak hours" or so.

To me it is obvious that the authorities built a system that is not justified in the way they handle it today: There's no tranparency, no visible communication of rules and no common sense in the way these rules are enforced.

These people here on the board who think that everything is OK the way it is have no good understanding of how a fair system should work.

-rAt

 #99870  by The RailMan
 
rAt,
I cannot put myself into your situation, but I do agree with efin98, you do have a bit of an attitude. I have railfanned in Europe. While in Ireland, I went around Iarnrod Eirann, I did not rely on finding a sign or verbal notification for potential photography bans. I looked for a railroad employee, who was actually worked the switch tower, explained to him my intentions of photography, and he was nice about it, even gave me a tour of the switch tower and turntable and all.
One of the reasons I've limited my railfanning is because of dealings with police. I have never had a confrontation with an officer of the law on for this reason, but I do not make a spectacle of myself. Tripods and flashes do draw attention. But if I were to be confronted by the police, I always kept Identification on me and gave the officer the respect they deserve. You can rant and rave about the MNRR employee and the officers who arrested you, but they were just doing their job. There are three sides to every story, and that third side is the truth. Whatever you "claimed" they did to you, it must have been justified. Did you resist? Did you mouth off to the officer? Did you refuse proof of identification? Our police may be different here than in present-day Germany. You said that you met many nice police officers during your time here, was the GCT one "not nice" because he caught you?

I will leave it at this, you may think me and some of the other members on this board are "ignorant" on this topic, but I believe you are "ignorant" too.
Call me patriotic, hard-ass, whatever you can come up with, and please respect our culture (you said about a police officer who spoke fast and with an accent, there are several types of accents in the Northeast alone)

 #99887  by rAtGallery
 
Oh, Tim,

what do you know about me and this situation: Nothing. Like others you're making up your own story to justify a thing that you somehow liked -- but that was not OK. So you really think it is impossible that police overreacted? Blue eyes, man ...

Your post is as pointless as if I would speculate that you are one of the MTA police officers that cuffed me.

I just returned from NYC and again was controlled for nothing a few times -- with a policemen telling me they we only doing this because his boss was watching. I had to listen to a MTA policeman telling me that all photography on all MTA property was forbidden. I asked several times at MTA and NYPD police stations what was allowed: "Photography is allowed on all subway stations and in the subways". I looked puzzled when one police officer added: "But you might get fined for it up to $25."

Hard to believe for some of you guys: There's something going wrong in this city. But I am sure you make it up by loving "your country" even more and waving some more flags, right? And arrest and threaten some foreigners, that might help too.

Well, if you don't have more to believe in, guys ...

-rAt

 #101266  by KFRG
 
Hard to believe for some of you guys: There's something going wrong in this city. But I am sure you make it up by loving "your country" even more and waving some more flags, right? And arrest and threaten some foreigners, that might help too.
Typical Eurotrash....
I can only second the points which have already been made. I especially agree with The RailMan on this one. You accuse people in this thread of not knowing you or your story, but want us to believe your side of it? Well, here's a tissue... If you were locked up for using a tripod in tourist-filled GCT, you must have said something very stupid, or just plain ignored the officer.
Excuse me, I have some flag waving to do... :-D

 #101496  by UpperHarlemLine4ever
 
You know what, I think this thread is getting out of hand. The guy is trying to tell his side of the story. And YES the MTA Police are a little heavy handed, not anything like the Metro North Police. After all, the MTA Police brass is all LIRR brass and they brought to the MTA police their style of policing , much unlike Metro North. Thing is there IS NO PHOTO BAN on the railroad and yet they are enforcing a non existent photo ban. I think enough said and think this thread should be shut down.

 #101847  by AMoreira81
 
Also, while taking pics in the hall is permitted, that right DOES NOT EXTEND into the platform area! (Those of us on the ACMU trip last December got reminded of that many times!)

 #102000  by chuchubob
 
AMoreira81 wrote:Also, while taking pics in the hall is permitted, that right DOES NOT EXTEND into the platform area! (Those of us on the ACMU trip last December got reminded of that many times!)
This is true, but so many people were taking pix anyway, that even some people who usually respect authority's wishes got into the act.

http://www.transitspot.com/gallery/Metr ... _12_05_008

http://www.transitspot.com/gallery/Metr ... _12_05_043

http://www.transitspot.com/gallery/Metr ... _12_05_044

Bob

 #102009  by Robert Paniagua
 
Thing is there IS NO PHOTO BAN on the railroad and yet they are enforcing a non existent photo ban.

Yeah, same thing down in Washington, DC WMATA. There's no photo ban there either, but they are also enforcing a similar non-existant ban.

 #102162  by Otto Vondrak
 
>Yawn.<

Tripods are not allowed for photography on MTA property. The police were in the right on this one.

1) You're blocking pedestrian traffic and causing a nusiance.

2) There is the possibiltiy your tripod could some how come in contact with the third rail and you could get hurt.

The MTA regulation banning tripods (without permit) is well-known and enforced regularly. This also keeps movie crews from just setting up wherever they please without permission.

Police dont take you into custody for no reason- I have a feeling we're not getting the whole story. Regardless, I dont care for the trash talk coming from both sides, so I'm cooling this thread off.

-otto-