Amtrak New Gulf Coast Service - New Orleans to Mobile AL

Interesting development.... however I'd hold off on a victory lap just yet.

I've yet to see any indication that Alabama has agreed to provide their portion of the state funding that's required here.

Gov. Ivey has held fast over the years (and thru multiple re-election campaigns) on not funding this, and I don't know if Mississippi and Louisiana are up for funding Alabama's portion.

eolesen wrote: ↑Tue Nov 22, 2022 7:18 pm Interesting development.... however I'd hold off on a victory lap just yet.

I've yet to see any indication that Alabama has agreed to provide their portion of the state funding that's required here.

Gov. Ivey has held fast over the years (and thru multiple re-election campaigns) on not funding this, and I don't know if Mississippi and Louisiana are up for funding Alabama's portion.

Ivey remains opposed, but I believe they have gotten around that hurdle by the City Council of Mobile (the City of Mobile is a big supporter) voting to bear Alabama's portion of the operating support required under 209 using city funds. I had thought Mississippi and Louisiana had agreed to support the service at the state level. Ivey's opposition did kill the Southern Rail Commission's initial effort to include a single train per day operating beyond Mobile to Florida which would have required Alabama (and Florida) state level support. It sounds like they may try pursuing that once again through the FRA's long distance study. They'd probably have to pitch it as extending the Sunset once again or much more likely extending the CONO.

So to summarize if the service launches I believe it will be a partnership between the States of Louisiana and Mississippi and the City of Mobile.

lordsigma12345 wrote: ↑Wed Nov 23, 2022 11:40 am

eolesen wrote: ↑Tue Nov 22, 2022 7:18 pm Interesting development.... however I'd hold off on a victory lap just yet.

I've yet to see any indication that Alabama has agreed to provide their portion of the state funding that's required here.

Gov. Ivey has held fast over the years (and thru multiple re-election campaigns) on not funding this, and I don't know if Mississippi and Louisiana are up for funding Alabama's portion.

Ivey remains opposed, but I believe they have gotten around that hurdle by the City Council of Mobile (the City of Mobile is a big supporter) voting to bear Alabama's portion of the operating support required under 209 using city funds. I had thought Mississippi and Louisiana had agreed to support the service at the state level. Ivey's opposition did kill the Southern Rail Commission's initial effort to include a single train per day operating beyond Mobile to Florida which would have required Alabama (and Florida) state level support. It sounds like they may try pursuing that once again through the FRA's long distance study. They'd probably have to pitch it as extending the Sunset once again or much more likely extending the CONO.

So to summarize if the service launches I believe it will be a partnership between the States of Louisiana and Mississippi and the City of Mobile.

The rail mileage from NOL to ORL is over 750 miles, so extending one proposed NOL-MOE round trip to Florida still won't require state support as long as it goes to at least Orlando. Going a step further, it would continue to Miami via Tampa (following the path of the Silver Star south of Jacksonville), but I know there are no plans to do that.

209 does allow for a local agency to be the funding source, so that's certainly one way to do it. Can't think of any other corridors which had a city vs. a state funding its portion.

That said, a local agency with a smaller pocketbook seems to be a risk -- the City is more likely to act quickly and back out of funding if it's not successful simply because they're going to feel the financial pinch faster than a State budget would.

And just so we're crystal clear... I really don't expect this to be a success. My prediction is that it will have taken longer to approve this service than it will actually operate once it's launched...

IIRC, various localities in Indiana joined with the state for a while to fund the Hoosier State for a while. That said, I agree that state funding is better than locality funding any day.

The big question I have is if track improvements were agreed to by Amtrak as part of this who is going to pay? Are they going to go to these state partners asking for help with the funding (again assuming Amtrak agreed to do some amount of capital work.) I doubt Amtrak is simply going to take this on themselves with a 209 service.

Yeah, the devil is always in the details, which we don't really know right now.

The original pork filled Infrastructure bill passed by Congress provides $12 billion for capital improvements and $250 million in operating assistance specifically for corridors and re-establishing LD in areas other than the NEC. Up to 80% of a corridor's capital investment can be covered by the Federal grant if they receive an award, with 20% from the local or state authorities.

The cynic in me says that settlement happened now so they'd be able to be eligible to apply for that specific grant program. FRA hasn't announced any grants from that just yet, but I'd think that those would be coming shortly. The bill was signed nine months ago. At some point, the cash drawer has to open up.

Just a friendly reminder
218+51+1

The infrastructure law is an authorization…now come annual appropriations acts.

OBTW, the House changes hands Jan 3, 2023.

Don’t hold your breath on those Feddybux …

Actually IIJA has a lot of appropriated funds - which would take additional action to claw back. There are some additional authorized funds that could be appropriated which are subject to politics but the bill actually did include a lot of guaranteed funds.

"Details emerge over Gulf Coast Amtrak route from Mobile to New Orleans, as former enemies become funding partners"
https://mississippitoday.org/2022/12/16 ... w-orleans/

Things are a little murky still, but based on the quotes, it seems like the service will be allowed to start with a longer run time and that additional funding will be requested to improve the service later on. In addition to what was already granted and pledged by the feds, states, and Amtrak, the Southern Rail Commission is seeking an additional $179 million in federal funding to be supplemented by the host railroads and port.

I suppose it is a victory for Amtrak in bringing the figure down from the 400-500 million that CSX and NS were originally demanding (and getting them to pay for some of their own improvements). The troubling part to me is that even with all of this spending, the SRC's chairman says the run time will only be improved to 3 hours, 23 minutes. My back of envelop calculation gives an average speed of about 45 mph which is pretty pathetic.

Or, perhaps it's a victory for CSX as Amtrak had to concede that their desired speeds and schedule were unrealistic without that $500M investment...

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Qualification runs have started: https://weartv.com/news/local/amtrak-tr ... eans-route

Amtrak train crews will begin required familiarization trips this week, learning the physical characteristics of the future route by operating Amtrak locomotives and railcars between Mobile, Ala., and New Orleans.

This process will continue for several months, in conjunction with the freight railroads that will host the service, to qualify engineers and conductors to begin Amtrak passenger train service on a 2023 date to be announced.

Stations: https://www.wlox.com/2023/02/04/amtrak- ... utType=amp

Amtrak signs are now up in Downtown Gulfport at the site of the planned train stop, the depot near the Hancock Whitney building.

The platforms are also now complete for the four Mississippi stops in Bay St. Louis, Gulfport, Biloxi and Pascagoula. Next week, Amtrak will begin making test runs from New Orleans to Mobile.

The Gulfport Museum of History staff inside the old train station are looking forward to seeing the passenger trains running again.
...
“We already have a new platform developed at the train depot and have a three million dollar project planned for renovation for the train depot,” Mayor Willis said. “Turning it into a micro brewery with an oyster bar is what the developers want to do there.”

The Amtrak test runs will continue for several months. No start date for the passenger train service has been announced yet, but we’ll be sure to keep you updated.

45 mph average speeds is normal across the country over Class 3 and Class 4 tracks owned by the freight railroad corporations. Why would anyone expect different between New Orleans and Mobile? To achieve higher average speeds, States and Federal government have always in the past granted additional funding towards, not the freight railroads. Why did Amtrak expect different results here?
Congress can change the laws to encourage passenger train growth, but it is the STB that sets fairness between the private enterprise and freights over the entire transportation network; ships, planes, trains, and trucks.

Man those ALC42’s are beautiful:

I've said it many times, Amtrak's best schemes are dark blue and darker shades of red. If all their equipment was that, it would be a much nicer fleet. The silver paints just don't work nowadays