Amtrak/LIRR Moynihan Train Hall

TDowling wrote: ↑Tue Dec 29, 2020 3:34 pm Most definitely I will be there on opening day. However, I’m a little confused as to whether NJT trains/tracks will be posted/announced in the new hall. If not then the only conceivable way for NJ passengers to use it is if they were to look on DepartureVision and plan accordingly.

I’m game for a meetup!

I can’t tell if this is a joke.

No, I would not expect any NJT services in the hall since none of the tracks are reachable directly.
Edit: a little unclear on NJT usage. The drone footage shows access to tracks 5/6 and above, so only tracks 1-4 are not reachable. the drone video even shows an Arrow car set. So…time will tell?

No, you shouldn’t have a “meet up” in the middle of a pandemic.

(And no, we shouldn’t have multiple threads covering the same topic, especially since a lot of the questions being asked here have been answered many times over in the older topic).

And here are some nice interior and exterior drone shots from the governor’s office:

The font on the signage inside the hall looks like what you would see at a major international airport. Clearly this has been designed at a level above what either the MTA or Amtrak would have done, in my view.

Congratulations to all of the people involved with this project.

Forgive me is this is answered...somewhere, but what's to become of the old Amtrak area?

When the "Train Hall" is closed(01:00 to 05:00) the old ticket window(s) and baggage claim areas on the NJT level are used
That covers "The Night Owls" (65,66,and 67) and an early am train to DC

MattW wrote: ↑Wed Dec 30, 2020 9:16 pm Forgive me is this is answered...somewhere, but what's to become of the old Amtrak area?

it's already been remodeled into an Amtrak/NJT waiting area, as the map at https://d2g63oyneaimm8.cloudfront.net/s ... ectory.pdf shows.

See the press release from end of November: NJ Transit and Amtrak Complete the Refresh of the Ticketed Waiting Area at New York Penn Station

You ought to see the "spread" in the Print Edition of Today's Times.

"Daddy, what's a print edition"?

Open Content (I think)

Definitely Open Content

Famous Times Editorial (paywalled)

As one who used "Old Penn" enough "to know up from down", I had no love whatever for that dungeon. Maybe it was "spectacular" when it opened during 1910 for PRR Intercity passengers (the LIRR was "segregated"), but when I first laid eyes on it circa 1953, it was anything but. The walls were only washed to maybe 7ft high, leaving the soot that had collected since 1910 quite visible. The WWII "blackout" of the ceiling skylights was never removed; imagine that twenty years later. The "half flying saucer" ticket cage built in the Waiting Room (enabling the former one to become concessions) was an eyesore. One might have thought "airline expedient" reservations and ticketing would be available...uh, behind the façade, it was the "same old"... "we'll have to wire for that space....". Know so first hand on that one.

So I didn't exactly "sob" when it came down. Anyone care to ask The Late Noel Weaver about his thoughts on that barn? Do a search of his material here and you'll find out.

X post from Amtrak Forum parallel topic:

You ought to see the "spread" in the Print Edition of Today's Times.

"Daddy, what's a print edition"?

Open Content (I think)

Gilbert B Norman wrote: ↑Thu Dec 31, 2020 8:07 amAs one who used "Old Penn" enough "to know up from down", I had no love whatever for that dungeon. Maybe it was "spectacular" when it opened during 1910 for PRR Intercity passengers (the LIRR was "segregated"), but when I first laid eyes on it circa 1953, it was anything but. The walls were only washed to maybe 7ft high, leaving the soot that had collected since 1910 quite visible. The WWII "blackout" of the ceiling skylights was never removed; imagine that twenty years later. The "half flying saucer" ticket cage built in the Waiting Room (enabling the former one to become concessions) was an eyesore. One might have thought "airline expedient" reservations and ticketing would be available...uh, behind the façade, it was the "same old"... "we'll have to wire for that space....". Know so first hand on that one.

To be fair, Mr. Norman, you could say the same thing about Grand Central in the 1970s. LL ramps closed off from above, WW2 blackout paint on the skylights, the whole east window to the concourse half-obscured by the Kodak billboard, the walls and ceiling black with 80 years of pollution and cigarette smoke... Just because Old Penn was a wreck in 1963 doesn't mean it couldn't have been restored to something better than what it was replaced with.

I think the cost of air-conditioning all that glass-enclosed space would have been prohibitive*; also, the PRR had tried to get some kind of. tax abatement from the City, pointing out that the annual tax bill exceeded the total revenue taken in through the ticket windows, to no avail. And everybody knew that passenger trains weren't going to last much longer anyway ...

* People lived without AC for the first 50 years because until 1945 or so it wasn't all that common in large buildings, but by the 60's it was expected just about everywhere -- I still marvel that we got through those East Coast summers without it.

I also can’t imagine the open space to the tracks (see https://static01.nyt.com/images/2019/04 ... &auto=webp) would be particularly safe in this day and age, never mind the fact that it takes away floor space currently used for vendors and waiting areas/lounges.

I also look at modern criticisms and they often boil down to “narrow stairways” and “mad scramble to the train”. Neither of those have anything to do with the building — the stairways are just as narrow as they were a century ago and are a function of the narrow platforms, while the mad scramble has everything to do with how dispatching works and our unreliable trains and tracks. Moynihan adds more escalators though, which, assuming they work and run in the proper direction, should help alleviate the crowding somewhat.

Wish there were some color photographs of the old Penn Station. Color photos from the 1960s or earlier are probably in poor condition at this point, and were of course more expensive than B&W.

I believe Jacqueline Bouvier Kennedy Onassis would be proud that the "spirit" of Penn Station has been resurrected.

lensovet wrote: ↑Fri Jan 01, 2021 3:39 am I also can’t imagine the open space to the tracks (see https://static01.nyt.com/images/2019/04 ... &auto=webp) would be particularly safe in this day and age, never mind the fact that it takes away floor space currently used for vendors and waiting areas/lounges.

As you probably know, the track level was later decked over (at the arrivals level) to accommodate the overhead catenary.

BandA wrote: ↑Fri Jan 01, 2021 3:46 pm Wish there were some color photographs of the old Penn Station. Color photos from the 1960s or earlier are probably in poor condition at this point, and were of course more expensive than B&W.

I found this: