Amtrak Downeaster Discussion Thread

[Gilbert B Norman]

A historical note; Union Station was chopped down by McNuisance shortly after he got run off the NH and took "refuge" on the B&M. The replacement was a "Patshack".

[Froggie]

Correct me if I'm misreading the slides, but it seems like they're saying putting the station near where union station used to be means the train would stop traffic everytime it came in; Which immediately makes option three over by Northern light seem like the better move...

I agree with Markhb that they seem to want to keep the option to connect to a service on that mountain line at some point. I had thought the study on the potential rock row train came back with such a high cost it was a non starter so it surprised me they seem to consider it a factor.

[markhb]

Correct me if I'm misreading the slides, but it seems like they're saying putting the station near where union station used to be means the train would stop traffic everytime it came in; Which immediately makes option three over by Northern light seem like the better move...

I agree with Markhb that they seem to want to keep the option to connect to a service on that mountain line at some point. I had thought the study on the potential rock row train came back with such a high cost it was a non starter so it surprised me they seem to consider it a factor.

ITA on the second point; I was surprised it even came up (Rock Row themselves do not seem to be in the best financial shape tbh). So far as the first point goes, I also agree, or at least have to wonder about how the crossing gates would be set up. Perhaps it's more a case that the train would still be going quite slowly as it entered or left the station, prolonging the crossing time on a very busy street (likely to become even more busy when it is reopened to 2-way traffic).

[Cosakita18]

Have there been any updates on the possible switch from Amfleet to Horizon coaches? NNEPRA hasn't publicly released any of their board reports since February.

[MEC407]

An Amtrak employee who works on the Downeaster told me a couple days ago that a Horizon car is currently on its way to Maine to be added to one of the Downeaster train sets, and more Horizons will follow suit in the next few months. As each Horizon car arrives, an Amfleet car will be returned to Amtrak for use on the Northeast Regional trains. There will be a period of mixed Amfleet-Horizon Downeaster train sets until the transition is complete.

[MBTAVideoClips]

Is there a reason they are changing the fleet up? I feel like the downeaster would rather use the amfleets, especially since they have power doors compared to the manual door horizons (I think). Is there something I'm missing?

[west point]

Is there a reason they are changing the fleet up? I feel like the downeaster would rather use the amfleets, especially since they have power doors compared to the manual door horizons (I think). Is there something I'm missing?

We would need to see the contract between NNE and Amtrak as to rolling stock passenger equipment. My speculation is that Amtrak is wanting more Amfleets on the NEC? It certainly appears Amtrak is keeping Amfleets on existing routes. Horizons for the Borealis & Cascades. Maybe Amtrak's not pushing the Gulf coast much is another example?

Much as we hate to admit the NEC is considered Amtrak's bread and butter as Regional loads are above pre pandemic. Now if the Acela-2s were in service will there be enough seats? Have no idea.

[MEC407]

No need to speculate: the reason, direct from Amtrak, is because the number of operable Amfleets continues to decline, and they are needed for the Northeast Regional service. They can't use Horizons on the Northeast Regional because Horizons have a top speed of 110 MPH, compared to a top speed of 125 MPH for the Amfleets, so that's why the change is happening.

I'll be sad to see the Amfleets go, but I understand why it's necessary. The Horizons aren't the most exciting cars on the rails, but then again neither are the Amfleets. At least we won't have Horizons for very long. The Airo trainsets will be on the Downeaster in a few years. https://www.amtrak.com/amtrak-airo

[CPF66]

Well I can say the new trainsets definitely make the Horizon cars look better.

[markhb]

Have there been any updates on the possible switch from Amfleet to Horizon coaches? NNEPRA hasn't publicly released any of their board reports since February.

They cancelled the March meeting and the April notes have now been posted here (PDF warning). Here is the Projects section from that report (from the February minutes):

Mr. Jim Russell reported that the Wells Area Improvement Project, specifically the track work, will resume in the summer (2024).

The Maine Turnpike Authority (MTA) and the town of Wells have finalized the necessary agreements to allow NNEPRA to access their respective properties to move the project forward. NNEPRA is waiting for an amended agreement from CSX, a permit from the MaineDEP, and confirmation from the FRA to proceed.

Jim noted that the bid request for the construction of the Wells platform is anticipated to be publicized in March of 2024, with construction expected to be underway as early as fall of 2024.

Patricia provided an update on the FRA Corridor ID Program (CID) and Fed/State Partnership, noting that Ms. Catherine Davidson had submitted all necessary paperwork for the CID program and is preparing to submit post-award paperwork for the Fed/State Partnership.

Patricia noted that a pilot program for service to Rockland is expected to launch in the summer of 2024. Additionally, Amtrak has put together a team and endorsed the project. Patricia said that a proposal with costs will be forthcoming.

Patricia reported that the Portland Station Relocation and Falmouth Station Project was progressing, noting discussions with the City of Portland and Town of Falmouth. A public meeting is anticipated to take place at the end of March 2024.

Later, they also note that they have applied for a PTC waiver for the Rockland project, since that line doesn't have it.

[markhb]

Also, if Amtrak's booking system is correct, 680 isn't slated to stop in OOB this summer (the later 4 southbound runs are). Does anyone know if that was the case in the past, or is that new?

[CSRR573]

two Horizons came off 448 wednesday night and went to Maine early thursday. The coaches are also seem to be refurbished. The ones ive walked through have all new carpeting still with the protective plastic on them. And the seats seem newer then the Amfleet ones.

[MEC407]

Agreed, they're clean and fresh inside.

Here's a video of Amtrak president Roger Harris speaking to members of Trainriders Northeast recently; a member asks about the Horizons and Harris explains why they're coming up here:

[STrRedWolf]

Agreed, they're clean and fresh inside.

Here's a video of Amtrak president Roger Harris speaking to members of Trainriders Northeast recently; a member asks about the Horizons and Harris explains why they're coming up here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=opbvunYfcVs

Read: We're putting newer equipment up there and swapping out stuff that's near end-of-life so we can get ready to scrap it.

[west point]

Read: We're putting newer equipment up there and swapping out stuff that's near end-of-life so we can get ready to scrap it.

Or sell them to Mexico for another 20 years of service?