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  • Amfleet Disposition Discussion Thread

  • Discussion related to Amtrak also known as the National Railroad Passenger Corp.
Discussion related to Amtrak also known as the National Railroad Passenger Corp.

Moderators: GirlOnTheTrain, mtuandrew, Tadman

 #1621007  by Greg Moore
 
I have thought about one use that wouldn't overly interest me:
PV - if I do someday own a railcar, I want a nice sleeper and open area with large windows.
This is sadly one thing the Amfleets lack. I know Amtrak experiment with a sleeper room at least once, but I can't see much interest in PV hands.

Now, one thing that Amtrak can do (and perhaps should) is something like

https://planetags.com/
 #1621012  by eolesen
 
R36 Combine Coach wrote: Wed Apr 26, 2023 2:21 pm
eolesen wrote: Wed Apr 26, 2023 2:39 am Museum fleets typically don't want HEP powered cars with sealed windows.
LIRR MP72/MP75s and P72s to note.
Let me clarify, since it's not clear if you were arguing or agreeing...

There's no question sealed window cars like this need to be preserved. My point is they're not favorites to run in excursion service because most locomotives in museum service don't have operating HEP, and running a standalone generator to try and provide 480V for air conditioning isn't an option for most.
 #1621049  by R36 Combine Coach
 
Comet Is (NJT/EL) also have made to some shortlines/tourist operations. These are 480v HEP.

As for the LIRR MP72/MP75/P72, these used a non-standard 600v power when in push-pull. Did the shortlines
and tourist outfits that purchased them convert to standard 480v?

The fuselage Amfleets seem out of touch at museums, shortlines and tourist roads. The fuselage would look
modern and sci-fi by comparsion to Lackawanna MUs and Reading Blueliners.
 #1621559  by BuddR32
 
Matt Johnson wrote: Sat Apr 22, 2023 9:16 am An Amfleet would be much more appealing for a ride from, say, NYP to Montauk than LIRR's normal rolling stock. But it's hard for me to see them lasting much longer in mainline service so I'd expect to see a few scattered about going to private owners like this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F7bMgqMSByU
As well built as the Amfleet was, and reliable, no way LIRR would even entertain using them for east end service. Diesel branch passengers feel slighted as it is, imagine trying to pawn off 50 year old cars onto them and say its an improvement.
 #1622353  by John_Perkowski
 
Here’s my question
Will these cars, when the time comes, be sold as is, or be sold with a current PC-1?

The market is near saturated for PV given how Amtrak supports PV charters. Why would anyone buy a car to be restored when a car with current certification is available?
 #1623391  by shadyjay
 
BuddR32 wrote: Fri May 05, 2023 11:03 am
Matt Johnson wrote: Sat Apr 22, 2023 9:16 am An Amfleet would be much more appealing for a ride from, say, NYP to Montauk than LIRR's normal rolling stock. But it's hard for me to see them lasting much longer in mainline service so I'd expect to see a few scattered about going to private owners like this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F7bMgqMSByU
As well built as the Amfleet was, and reliable, no way LIRR would even entertain using them for east end service. Diesel branch passengers feel slighted as it is, imagine trying to pawn off 50 year old cars onto them and say its an improvement.
I rode out to Montauk (from GCT, changing at Jamaica) last week, and from what I could tell you, Amfleets would be an improvment. Present equipment on LIRR running to the east end is the double decker coaches. The only power outlet I could find in the car was the one right by the entrance door, most likely for vaccums or other cleaning equipment. The cars did feature 2-2 seating on two levels, but the interiors seemed really spartan to me. I know they're commuter equipment, but just blah. And the announcements would've been louder and more clearer if they came from a tin can.

So, yeah, I could see them running out that far. In reality, would they? Probably not. But stranger things have happened.
 #1623407  by Gilbert B Norman
 
Well Mr. Hogan, sorry you weren't around for this, as were both Mr. Deasy and I.

However, I must confess that I never had an end-to-end "Cannonball Run"; once during the all Parlor Car era circa '65, as a Fairfield Navy Cadet, I had orders to report for duty at Amagansett. Not Montauk, Amagansett (yes Sir). So it was an "almost but not quite" end to end.

But alas nowadays, "those who count" all have their "choppers" to get out to their weekend playground; the "egalitarian" L I R R is "for the help'.
 #1623413  by STrRedWolf
 
shadyjay wrote: Sun Jun 04, 2023 4:34 pm I rode out to Montauk (from GCT, changing at Jamaica) last week, and from what I could tell you, Amfleets would be an improvment. Present equipment on LIRR running to the east end is the double decker coaches. The only power outlet I could find in the car was the one right by the entrance door, most likely for vaccums or other cleaning equipment. The cars did feature 2-2 seating on two levels, but the interiors seemed really spartan to me. I know they're commuter equipment, but just blah. And the announcements would've been louder and more clearer if they came from a tin can.

So, yeah, I could see them running out that far. In reality, would they? Probably not. But stranger things have happened.
I would think LIRR would move more towards bi-levels in the general case, even ordering Bombardier Multilevels. I mean, what are we talking about for weekend and weekday load? Are all the seats taken? Remember, LIRR used to run crush loads.
 #1623417  by Gilbert B Norman
 
I should note that I had one "final cruise" as a Fairfield Navy Cadet during '74. That too was to a report for duty at Amagansett. By then, The Cannonball had been badly downgraded. The Parlors had become ex-New Haven 14-4 "--Point" Sleepers - hardly the conviviality of the '65 version.

And DREADFUL!!!! there were Coaches (ex-KCS reportedly still in service in NC) and a Dining Car (ex-LV). So far as that went, the "cuisine" was unlike any I had ever had on the rails or would want to have again.
 #1626351  by west point
 
Once again Amtrak has lost the ability to build its ridership for more than double digits. The A-320 family of aircraft have just received a directive to remove P&W engines on an accelerated basis which will mean some will be parked with no engines. Now this is just one more incident that shows the need for Amtrak to refurbish as many Amfleets to be in a surge fleet.

We do not know what incident(s) in the future will push the need for more Amtrak equipment on each train. But it is a guarantee that incidents will happen.

https://www.aerotime.aero/articles/pw-n ... production.

PW1100G, PW 1500G, PW1900G among other models.
 #1626353  by west point
 
As a follow up this will be an ongoing reduced interval of removals and inspections. My experience is that engine overhaul facilities are planned to be closely scheduled for planned intervals. There will be many facilities who cannot increase work. So, Amtrak will be missing a long-time opportunity.
 #1626368  by RandallW
 
What opportunity? From news reports this affects four airlines (Spirit Airlines, JetBlue Airways, Hawaiian Airlines and Wizz Air (Hungary)). Two of those airlines are in areas not served by Amtrak at all, one (Spirit) is concentrated on international flights in the Caribbean basin and serves US domestic routes that Amtrak is not time competitive on (such as New Orleans-Orlando (2 hours by plane, or 48 hours by Amtrak if no train is delayed and no connections are missed)).
 #1626371  by Gilbert B Norman
 
west point wrote: Wed Jul 26, 2023 8:17 pm Once again Amtrak has lost the ability to build its ridership for more than double digits. The A-320 family of aircraft have just received a directive to remove P&W engines on an accelerated basis which will mean some will be parked with no engines.
Officer (Captain?) West Point, this matter regarding the inspection of P&W aircraft engines IS more Amtrak related than some might realize.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/new-engine ... n-ab206106

The two main carriers BOS-LGA-DCA are American and Jet Blue (Delta is also there). American has A-320's in their fleet and Jet Blue's fleet of aircraft is largely comprised of A-320's (zero Boeings). No question whatever, these mandated inspections will require some "hangar time" and will mean both carriers will need to reduce flight schedules resulting in both passenger inconvenience and higher fares.

As you note, will Amtrak have the resources to add either frequencies or cars to their present schedule?

BTW; "The Generals" are flying high of late; both in the air and on Wall Street.

Disclaimer: author Long RTX and "took a pasting".
Last edited by Gilbert B Norman on Thu Jul 27, 2023 7:33 am, edited 1 time in total.
 #1626376  by chrisf
 
We're way off topic but this problem only affects A320 series aircraft with the specific new Pratt engine; most A32x aircraft will not be affected by this at all. American does not use the P&W in their A320NEOs https://www.marketwatch.com/story/here- ... m-d024af50
Jetblue has Pratt powered A321NEOs but they're used on long routes which would not compete with Amtrak.