Acela II (Alstom Avelia Liberty): Design, Production, Delivery, Acceptance

ExCon90 wrote: ↑Wed Jun 26, 2024 7:46 pm Is HAM what used to be MILLHAM

Yes. The tower still had a PC MILLHAM sign until about ten years ago.

Thanks.

PRRTechFan wrote: ↑Sat Jun 22, 2024 8:21 pm Mr. Livonious... I have been fascinated reading your updates about Acela II testing. I've been away from Railroad.net for a while now. I used to know just about everything there was to know about traction power, signalling and the interlockings along the NEC... at least in New Jersey; but a lot of things have changed. I know Union Interlocking was broken up into several pieces years ago. Nassau has been gone for a lot longer than that! I'm assuming that HAM controls the area around the newer Hamilton Station. You have referred to DELCO, but I don't know where that is... I suspect near the yard for the former GM Plant in Linden?

I believe Delco (shares the name with the Delco lead track, which runs in the same area) and Adams (similar interlocking in the opposite direction) were installed in the mid 2010s while catenary and signaling upgrades on the New Brunswick - Trenton section were carried out. Upgrades included conversion to Rule 562 territory where all wayside signals were removed and only interlocking home signals remained. I think parts of track 3 were also converted to constant tension very early on in order to carry out Acela testing at 165mph+ back in 2012. Constant tension was eventually completed later but only from Midway - CP Clark. An alternate steady-arm assembly (SAP?) was used Midway - County. CP Clark - Fair constant tension is moving at a snail's pace.

Delco interlocking allows "canonically" track 4 trains to bypass a short pocket where trains are "turning on the main" at Jersey Ave on track 4. Bypassing trains can quickly get around stopped trains there and return to track 4.

Adams interlocking is similar but allows canonically track 1 trains to get around movements at the Adams Switch, which leads to Amtrak's Adams MW Base.

PRRTechFan wrote: ↑Sat Jun 22, 2024 8:21 pm How do they handle the actual testing? I assume there is permission (Form D?) to run a specific track between specific limits. In one night, do they make several high-speed runs back and forth on the same track within those times and limits? What happens at each "turn" or change in direction? I know at one time "Direction of Traffic" had to be set for tracks 2 and 3 between opposing interlockings to permit operation in the desired direction. Is that just... a call to the dispatcher to set direction and display the signals now?

My guess is Form D since you have to be given permission to exceed timetable and track speed limits. This could be delivered by radio, phone or possibly fax (like TSRBs) since this is a highly planned test.

The testing should look like this:
1. KP2022 waits for #2173 to pass Ham on track 3 at 8:58PM (testing used to start earlier by sending #2173 down track 2 all the way back at Lincoln)
2. Dispatcher reverses the direction of track 3 from Ham to County. KP2022 starts an eastbound run.
3. #657 needs to switch from track 3 to track 4 to make Princeton Junction. #657 can do this early at County and is scheduled to reach County at 9:05PM, then the dispatcher reverses County - Lincoln to eastbound.
4. KP2022 passes County and prepares to stop.
5. Dispatcher sees KP2022 clear of County, reverses track signal direction to Ham. This is usually done without any communication.
6. Crew walks to rear of train, starts up in opposite direction all the way back to Ham (I don't know where exactly they end and whether they go through Ham)

Track 3 County - Lincoln is not reversed (stays eastbound when testing begins around 9PM) as KP2022 just needs to enter the western edge of this block and doesn't pass any automatic signals. When they turn around the first signal they see is the County home signal. Sometimes this interferes with maintenance moves all the way to Lincoln.

With #2173 needing to clear first and #657 operating on the testing block while KP2022 is already heading east on the same track, this is can be a really delicate operation.

In certain cases, the eastern end of the testing block is shortened to Delco so KP2022 stops between Delco and County.

PRRTechFan wrote: ↑Sat Jun 22, 2024 8:21 pm I am probably too far east of the NEC to receive VHF radio transmissions; but would you be willing to share the frequencies you are scanning?

NEC Road is 161.01MHz or AAR channel 60. A handheld radio will not help you; you need a real antenna high up. I can pickup PSCC transmissions when they use the antenna inside Sunnyside Yard to talk to equipment and personnel near Harold. That's almost 30 miles away, but it's usually poor quality.

If you live in Manasquan, you might be able to pick up the transmitters at Midway and Adams MW. Those are 30-31 miles away. The antennas at Lincoln and near Fair are the next nearest antennas at 33 and 37 miles away, respectively.

Consult radioreference.com for NJ railroad frequencies: https://www.radioreference.com/db/aid/9391

Consult radioreference.com's FCC data for Amtrak antenna locations: https://www.radioreference.com/db/fcc/frn/0002159770 (Searching by licensee name, callsign or FRN does not require an account)

RandallW wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2024 7:34 pm There have been no issues with CAF Mark 5 sleepers in Scotland,... (I'm not arguing the Mark 5As were successes, mind you, but the sleepers were anything but a "dumpster fire").

This is grossly incorrect. The CAF sleepers in Scotland have been a disaster by any measure. It is common to find reviewers complaining about door locks not working, toilets malfunctioning, entire bar/lounge cars being out of service due to problems with the cars... It has been an abject comedy of errors at this point. There have also been structural cracks and malformations in damper mountings and other places.

Although personal anecdotes are not necessarily indicative of pervasive issues, my personal experience on the new sleepers was exactly this - the restaurant-lounge car was out of service for breakfast due to mechanical issues.

I can find tons of reporting on the failures of the Mark 5a coaches, but only one paywalled article (that I can't read b/c of the paywall) stating that defects were found in the Caledonian sleepers. If one article suggesting there might be a failure on some pieces of equipment (again can't afford to read any article) after 5+ years of service is a "dumpster fire" I seriously doubt *any* rail equipment design can't be called a "dumpster fire".

Put another way, I wonder if we are more aware of expected equipment failures that would not have been publicized by private operators because would have quietly replaced the part which are being publicized by publicly-owned operators because they are, put bluntly, publicly owned and every record not explicitly excepted from release is publicly available (possibly with a FOIA or similar transparency law within that jurisdiction request).

RandallW wrote: ↑Wed Jul 10, 2024 7:35 am I can find tons of reporting on the failures of the Mark 5a coaches, but only one paywalled article (that I can't read b/c of the paywall) stating that defects were found in the Caledonian sleepers. If one article suggesting there might be a failure on some pieces of equipment (again can't afford to read any article) after 5+ years of service is a "dumpster fire" I seriously doubt *any* rail equipment design can't be called a "dumpster fire".

Read some reviews of the service. Go on facebook and check out the scottish and british railfan groups. Watch youtube reviews. These are known widesspread issues. There are actually two trains every night - the Highlander to the far north of Scotland and the Lowlander to the big cities of Glasgow and Edinburgh. The Lowlander got the new cars first and they were so bad they delayed the EIS on the highlander for months to fix problems. I know this because in 2019 I planned a last minute trip to ride the old cars on the Highlander well after they were planned to be retired.


Paul Lucas is a noted travel blogger and I enjoy his work, look at his review:


"no hot water at all for the entire trip. This is a common and well-publicised problem with the new sleeper which has been beset with problems since day one"

"there are so many problems with getting stuff to work"

"The new caledonian sleepr is not a good product... the execution of so many things is very poor. It failes to deliver regularly.. I've had the shower problem on two trips... I can't recomend the caledonian sleeper"

These are congruent with my experiences aboard. Diner car power outages, door lock problems, etc... not a good look.

The poms love to moan, especially about British Rail, or its modern equivalents.

In my travels, I've been on every kind of car operated by Amtrak, and I've been on trains where at least one car of each type (Heritage, Amfleet I and II, Superliner, ex-ATSF Hi Liner, Viewliner I, Viewliner II) has had plumbing or other issues () at one time or another while I've ridden it. By your standards, that means that even passenger cars manufactured pre-Amtrak are dumpster fires. I suspect we merely see more stories of problems shared today than it was possible for people to share in the 1960s simply because sharing those stories is much easier now than it was (or maybe we were just more willing to accept brokenness then than we are now).

Having just travelled on AMTK 97, and been delayed an hour in WAS because the engineer for 97 train was bringing the NB 166 (I think) into WAS, and not having a diner on 97 because (according the onboard crew), Sunnyside didn't have the staff to address some defect while turning the train (so it was towed out of service at the end of the train to Hialeah to be fixed), I think that, post COVID, the most likely sources of problems with any passenger service is lack of people. Solve that problem and other problems will also be solved.

RandallW wrote: ↑Sun Jul 14, 2024 6:32 am By your standards, that means that even passenger cars manufactured pre-Amtrak are dumpster fires.

WTF no. Not even remotely. Cars made pre-Amtrak were made pretty well and due to deferred maintenance later became very problematic. It was not a design or manufacturing flaw. It was an Amtrak flaw in the first five years.

This is different than the CAF cars that, despite the evidence in the record, you insist on telling us are not dumpster fires.

My dude, they delayed EIS for the CAF cars for a long time. THere were problems. You are entitled to your own opinion but not your own facts.

If Amtrak were free to use equipment designs that have been tried and proven in other countries, we would see a lot fewer problems. But God forbid we should use anything on Amtrak that was Not Invented Here.

charlesriverbranch wrote: ↑Tue Jul 16, 2024 7:08 am If Amtrak were free to use equipment designs that have been tried and proven in other countries, we would see a lot fewer problems. But God forbid we should use anything on Amtrak that was Not Invented Here.

I thought going to the manufacturer of the legendary TGV to order a more or less off the shelf design would result in fewer problems, yet here we are.

The issue here is that America has different standards than Europe does. It dealt with accidents differently and thus has a different philosophy towards train cars. An off-the-Eurpoean-shelf design would require modifications to meet American standards... and getting it right is going to be a longer process than anyone outside thinks.

With testing apparently stalled and very little news, I'm beginning to wonder, is Alstom too big to fail? Or more specifically this order in particular, given its advanced stage of manufacture and delivery? I hesitate to bring up the RTL-III Turboliners, but there is precedent for throwing away brand new unused hardware. This however is obviously a much bigger and more visible program (~$2 billion invested in next gen Acela as I recall vs ~$100 million in the NYDOT Turbo fiasco).

Matt Johnson wrote: ↑Fri Jul 19, 2024 9:39 am With testing apparently stalled and very little news, I'm beginning to wonder, is Alstom too big to fail?

Comedic timing. They were out on a test last night 2-3 hours before you posted. I'd argue that the contiuance of testing (and not advancing to crew qualification) is supportive of your argument, though.

KP2022 was out last night. I didn't review radio yet but I see CETC-8 was trying to make contact at 8:45PM. Thanks to The Philly Buff for bringing attention: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PM_tlcDoWYc

There was a report Thursday morning/afternoon that a trainset moved from Philly to Wilmington and back, but I failed to follow up.

Keeping an eye out for 30 minutes or so.

Seems to me the common denominator,in all these European "failures", is Amtrak.