A-Day + 51

Actually its NRPC National Rail Passenger Corp.

That is correct there is no book on how to handle even the smallest of emergencies. As a long retired conductor I worked with once said "if they ever figure it out we all go broke". Well it stands just as true now as it did 24 and change ago when I first met him.

I am very much like the traveling public, just want to go from point A to B as quickly and with as little trouble as possible.

Probably many of Amtrak's problems are caused by the chaos Mr Railjunkie points out. Why does it take hours to rescue a train that breaks down on the Corridor? Why do any kinds of operational problems seem to quickly spiral out of control, leading to massive delays?
Trains used to be the safest mode of transportation. Now the commercial airline industry has been virtually accident free for over 2 decades while trains continue to wreck. One thing that happened was, the airlines adopted a system where employees could anonymously report safety issues. Amtrak management, locked in a chronic war with its Agreement employees, refused to adopt the system.
I can understand that Amtrak's timekeeping is at the mercy of Class I dispatching but I can't understand why its timekeeping is so bad on the NEC which it mostly dispatches itself. I can only conclude that Amtrak management actually doesn't care if its trains are on time. Its only response to adverse dispatching on the Class I's seems to be to lengthen its schedules such that we have slower trains than ran in 1900.

The return of diners and Sightseer Lounges would be great, but if Amtrak can't run a reliable railroad, where the trains are reasonably ontime, where the equipment is maintained and where the trains are serviced as needed, riders will just stay in their personal vehicles.
No one knows if Amtrak can recover its passengers in the face of so many knowledge workers working from home, but right now, this lifelong railroad lover can't recommend Amtrak to a potential customer.

STrRedWolf wrote: ↑Thu May 05, 2022 6:10 am

Railjunkie wrote: ↑Wed May 04, 2022 2:04 pm Actually its NRPC National Rail Passenger Corp.

Amtrak uses AMTK and AMTZ for the FRA reporting mark. MBTA uses MBTX. MARC uses MARC but seems to be unlisted in the Official Railway Equipment Register. Metro-North is MNCW, METRA is METX... But I haven't seen any subway entities here such as WMATA.

Weird, I know I've seen "MARC" as the reporting mark on their gear, but they aren't listed.
X means non common carrier, car/locomotive owner/lessor, and museums.
There reference to wmata was mission creep, I guess I should have used NJTR as a semi dysfunctional transit agency.

To add to this topic creep, even if this relates "of sorts" to A-Day+51, AMTZ was assigned to the Roadrailers that, as we all know, were the "W Gang's salvation" for the LD's.

Never did learn of an AMTU, or what would have been an overseas shipping container.

JoeG wrote: ↑Wed May 04, 2022 7:15 pm Probably many of Amtrak's problems are caused by the chaos Mr Railjunkie points out. Why does it take hours to rescue a train that breaks down on the Corridor? Why do any kinds of operational problems seem to quickly spiral out of control, leading to massive delays?
Trains used to be the safest mode of transportation. Now the commercial airline industry has been virtually accident free for over 2 decades while trains continue to wreck. One thing that happened was, the airlines adopted a system where employees could anonymously report safety issues. Amtrak management, locked in a chronic war with its Agreement employees, refused to adopt the system.

There were/are two different safety systems in use. Both were confidential, the one involving safety matters involving slips trips and falls was called Safe to Safer a pretty good program the may have actually worked. Still have my green helmet from that one.

It worked by observers going out into the field and watching employees from our own craft at work. If we saw something we we wrote it down. Could be something as small as boots or a known tripping hazard. If we saw something that put someone in danger we stopped whatever was going on and gave counsel. Completely devoid of management. It worked so we stopped using it.

The second which is still in use today is a confidential reporting system used by not only us but other railroads through NASA. Yes the guys who play with rockets. Plenty of info on line about that one. Another adopted program from the airlines is situational awareness, all of our pilots on here can explain how this came about better than I.

What's with Amtrak's schedules? Are they even published any more?

My girlfriend went to book an overnight trip from Boston to Virginia, but 67 is "sold out". Apparently it's "sold out" for the entire spring and summer? Who's running Amtrak these days? Abbott and Costello?

I thought the recently passed infrastructure bill had flooded Amtrak with money; where's it all going? Clearly not toward running the railroad.

charlesriverbranch wrote: ↑Mon May 09, 2022 12:31 pm What's with Amtrak's schedules? Are they even published any more?

No more timetables. Cost cutting casualty.

My girlfriend went to book an overnight trip from Boston to Virginia, but 67 is "sold out". Apparently it's "sold out" for the entire spring and summer? Who's running Amtrak these days? Abbott and Costello?

I thought the recently passed infrastructure bill had flooded Amtrak with money; where's it all going? Clearly not toward running the railroad.

66/67 I believe are casualties of the latest cutbacks, and aren't running at all until at least September. Before that, the sleeper was only available as far as Washington DC. So someone going to Richmond, Williamsburg, or Newport News where a sleeper would actually make the most sense couldn't even make use of it.

I don't know why Amtrak can't just take the level of service offered before all of the cutbacks and say this is our baseline if we're serious about running a national passenger railroad.

Matt Johnson wrote: ↑Mon May 09, 2022 1:14 pm I don't know why Amtrak can't just take the level of service offered before all of the cutbacks and say this is our baseline if we're serious about running a national passenger railroad.

If you don't have the crews you cannot run the trains. Like everyone else, Amtrak is suffering from labor issues.

I'm sorry, but you can't run a railroad if people don't know when the trains are running. Even railroads on the brink of bankruptcy issued timetables; I have in my possession a copy of the last New York Central timetable, dated December 3, 1967, just before they went into the black hole that was Penn Central.

If they're not going to run 66/67, take it off the schedule instead of marking it "sold out". More importantly, what trains are they running? My girlfriend decided to drive to Virginia; Amtrak just lost a customer.

What happened to the damned crews? Surely they didn't all die of Covid.

charlesriverbranch wrote: ↑Mon May 09, 2022 4:34 pm What happened to the damned crews? Surely they didn't all die of Covid.

No they did not die. Amtrak laid a bunch of them off and they never came back. I am hearing conductor classes sizes down in Wilmington that are in the 70s. So I would wager class sizes that big for on board also. They are behind the proverbial eight ball and now they are trying to get it all back at once.

Where the $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ went??? Read the Wreck of the Penn Central.

charlesriverbranch wrote: ↑Mon May 09, 2022 4:34 pm I'm sorry, but you can't run a railroad if people don't know when the trains are running.

Mr. Charles, your quoted post does not reflect "how things are" nowadays. Find me an airline that has printed timetables.

True, go to an advocacy site, such as the one that ran me off some three years ago, and you will see rantings about the absence of printed timetables. But what their members overlook is their absence gives the carriers the flexibility to change arrival and departure times as requirements of service dictate, so long as they notify ticketed passengers of the change.

This debate regarding the ostensible "need" for printed timetables reminds me of an experience I had during July '68. I had a year old SP timetable with me that I had during my tour in Vietnam. I was coming home (in one piece) the flight was set to land at KSUU (Travis AFB) 530A. It did or thereabouts and I was free about 6A. This SP timetable showed #9, Cascade, departing Fairfield @705A. Now can I find a taxicab willing to take me there when the alternative for him was "load 'em up for a ride to SFO". But this driver was happy to take saying he could get back to Travis and still "get in the action". I was just "gravy" - fine for me and him!

Not knowing what lay ahead (had "passenger train hating" SP gotten it off over the year?), here it comes right on time. I rode to Oakland 16th St. taxicabbed to the WP Station, rode the Zephyr to Sacramento. taxicabbed to SP, then rode 102 "City" to Ogden, checked into my next duty at Hill AFB, then met my Mother at SLC and from there we toured about the West for the next two weeks before heading home (Greenwich CT) for the balance of my 30 day leave.

Gilbert B Norman wrote: ↑Mon May 09, 2022 6:28 pm True, go to an advocacy site, such as the one that ran me off some three years ago, and you will see rantings about the absence of printed timetables. But what their members overlook is their absence gives the carriers the flexibility to change arrival and departure times as requirements of service dictate, so long as they notify ticketed passengers of the change.

Correct. With the fluidness of services (not just Amtrak, but state supported Amtrak and commuter services) scheduling will be a mess for a period of time. Imagine a Northeast Corridor timetable right now. As there are changes to state-supported services, increased Amtrak crew availability and the summer track work season, you might be changing that timetable frequently. Amtrak has a handy mobile app that works just like the airlines apps for determining flights.

By the way, I am the millennial nostalgic for paper timetables. I have the current SEPTA timetable in my desk along with the last pre-COVID timetable. I used to have a Keystone timetable in my desk as well. If Amtrak ever brings them back (even if just online), I will print it.

Railjunkie wrote: ↑Mon May 09, 2022 5:32 pm

charlesriverbranch wrote: ↑Mon May 09, 2022 4:34 pm What happened to the damned crews? Surely they didn't all die of Covid.

No they did not die. Amtrak laid a bunch of them off and they never came back. I am hearing conductor classes sizes down in Wilmington that are in the 70s. So I would wager class sizes that big for on board also. They are behind the proverbial eight ball and now they are trying to get it all back at once.

Where the $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ went??? Read the Wreck of the Penn Central.

There have been a lot of retirements and a year to 18 months of no crew classes. Anecdotally the average age of crew members seems to be noticeably lower than before COVID and I am seeing a lot more training (on SEPTA and Amtrak).

what with downloadable pdf's I don't think putting out timetables is the expense it was back in the day. So, timetables are an inexpensive convenience for customers. It is easier to see your options with a pdf than with Amtrak's current arrangement. But once again, Amtrak just doesn't care.