• 19000-series Wooden Cabooses

  • Discussion relating to the NYC and subsidiaries, up to 1968. Visit the NYCS Historical Society for more information.
Discussion relating to the NYC and subsidiaries, up to 1968. Visit the NYCS Historical Society for more information.

Moderator: Otto Vondrak

  by BR&P
 
You're welcome. Are the plans to restore the interior to railroad configuration, or gut it for displays?
  by AteamSHS
 
Sorry for the delay, I didn't see your post. our plan is to restore the inside to its original layout.
  by BR&P
 
Great! Glad to hear that. There are several sources for pics of the interiors "back then". I'm not aware of any one article which goes in depth (altho possibly some old issue of the NYCRRHS "Headlight" might have one). But there are various other places where you can piece together a pretty good understanding.

For one example, Knapke's book "The Railroad Caboose" has a cut-away drawing on the inside cover, plus some NYC company photos in the book itself.

Good luck and keep us posted on your progress!
  by Otto Vondrak
 
Here's a link to a blueprint I had scanned at my local office supply depot:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/ottomatic ... 693639893/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

The drawing is dated 1941. I can provide you a PDF copy in the interest of preservation if you contact me.

-otto-
  by BR&P
 
Otto Vondrak wrote:Here's a link to a blueprint I had scanned at my local office supply depot:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/ottomatic ... 693639893/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

The drawing is dated 1941. I can provide you a PDF copy in the interest of preservation if you contact me.

-otto-
Otto, while there may be some beenfit from that drawing, it's actually not correct for what that group is doing. They have the former NYC 19216, which is a typical "19000 series" caboose which actually included some 17000 and 18000 series cabs.

The drawing is a bit puzzling to me. It's labeled as a 19000 series but actually is a drawing of the 50 (20100 - 20149) cabooses built in East Buffalo in 1944. The car is longer, the window spacing is different, slight interior differences, and other minor details set this off from the "typical" NYC cabooses. Where did the 1941 date come from? I suspect it's actually drawn a bit after that.

Again, perhaps "ATeam" can get some use from that. But I would caution against thinking that drawing applies to the car they are restoring.
  by Otto Vondrak
 
BR&P wrote:The drawing is a bit puzzling to me. It's labeled as a 19000 series but actually is a drawing of the 50 (20100 - 20149) cabooses built in East Buffalo in 1944. The car is longer, the window spacing is different, slight interior differences, and other minor details set this off from the "typical" NYC cabooses. Where did the 1941 date come from? I suspect it's actually drawn a bit after that.
Upon further review, I see it is a drawing for New York Central 20100-20149 wooden caboose, Lot 732. I can barely make out the date September 22, 1941, in the lower right hand corner.

-otto-
  by BR&P
 
Sept 22, 1941 is well before Pearl Harbor. Sources I have seen, but can't put my fingers on, showed those built in 1944, presumably to help in the war effort. That seems like a long lead time from planning to production, roughly 3 years. Perhaps the shortage of materials contributed to that delay. I had *assumed* they were a result of the war, not something that was planned before it began. The learning never stops! :-D

FWIW, it was from that lot of cars that 5 were selected to be painted in Pacemaker colors - 20112, 20117, 20129, 20132 and 20133.
  by BR&P
 
Here's a site with lots of NYC caboose info, and links to detailed discussion of the various types: https://nycshs.org/nycs-research-information/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

And here's one of those links, with details of those 50 cars in Lot 232 which Otto has plans for. https://nycshs.files.wordpress.com/2014 ... ssics2.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; Let me suggest that while these 50 cars were not identical in number nor construction with the "19000" series in the thread title, it is more than appropriate to discuss them here as well IMHO.
  by BR&P
 
For AteamSHS as info for your restoration: among the links mentioned above is this one https://nycshs.files.wordpress.com/2014 ... 1975q1.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

You will note that on pages 7 and 8 there are interior pics of a P&LE wooden caboose from the same plans as your NYC 19216. This is a good reference for you. I will note a couple minor differences - in the NYC cabooses I was in, the fold-down desk was not across from the stove as shown, but rather between the 2 side windows farther from the cupola. Maybe the conductors were too hot, I don't know, but I was in MANY of them and don't recall seeing any where the table was by the stove.

Also, the heat shielding on the locker wall did not usually extend up that high. The topmost section in that pic was not there as I recall. I'm not prepared to say "always" and "never", that was a long time ago and I was not specifically looking for that shielding when I was there. But seeing that P&LE pic it immediately jumped out at me as "wrong".

Likewise the P&LE pic shows the coal bunker between the stove and the wall. That's not what the NYC's had, but I'll be darned if I can recall whether the coal was between the bunk and the stove, or between the stove and the locker wall. I THINK it was by the bunk.

The only other observation I'll add was that I never ever saw a NYC caboose with the cushions as shown in the pic - one per section, flat on each bunk. Maybe that was the intent, and maybe that's how they came out of the shop, but there ALWAYS were extra cushions on at least 2 or 3 sections, sometimes with a backing to allow laying back in a semi-reclining position. It was nothing standard or consistent, just how each crew arranged their quarters. But at least 2 cushions one on top of the other was the desired furnishing.

I was in another 19000 caboose which has been nicely restored, and I told those folks that to be totally accurate it needed dirt on the floor, grime on the windows, some old newspapers on one of the bunks, and the aroma of stale tobacco smoke and maybe a bit of kerosene in the air. (Since we're talking about open-to-the-public here, we'll skip the discussion of a few pin-ups on the walls :wink: )
  by BR&P
 
On Page 3 of this thread I posted an interior pic of NYC 19106 taken in the early 1960's, exact date unknown. That pic no longer comes up, probably due to some software update on the forum. Here's a re-post. Lower half was a brown or reddish-brown. Top half was cream. Photo was taken on the Second Belt job, as the train prepared to head south from Kodak at Ridge Road in Rochester at perhaps 8PM. Conductor was R. E. Bernhardt.
NYC 19106 interior.jpg
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