anyone know where to find details of this plan? In particular, there's a bit in 30th st station that says the PRR, as part of this plan, wanted to build a loop track so that trains could operate continuously through Philadelphia. does anyone know what this means? would it have come under the parkway to suburban and out through 30th st?
Railroad Forums
Philadelphia Terminal Improvements Plan
- Discussion relating to the PRR, up to 1968. Visit the PRR Technical & Historical Society for more information.
The Railway Age map is online somewhere, but you can envision it easily enough-- the loop was to be a 180-degree bend connecting the south end of 30th St Lower Level with the south end of the 32nd St tunnel. Trains from the west to NY could use 30th St Lower Level and return to the east-west main line without backing or changing ends.
timz wrote:The Railway Age map is online somewhere, but you can envision it easily enough-- the loop was to be a 180-degree bend connecting the south end of 30th St Lower Level with the south end of the 32nd St tunnel. Trains from the west to NY could use 30th St Lower Level and return to the east-west main line without backing or changing ends.in from the west, out towards the zoo?
As you leave Zoo inbound to Upper Level 30th St (using one of the two usual inbound tracks, curving to your right), on your left you can see where there used to be two tracks descending to a tunnel portal between the inbound and outbound tracks. That tunnel joins the tunnel that curves the two tracks from Upper Level southward toward Wilmington. So a train from Pittsburgh could take that tunnel, reach daylight where an R2 train does now, then curve 180 degrees to its left and enter Lower Level 30th St.
(No idea whether they planned to take that route or run around the loop in the other direction.)
(No idea whether they planned to take that route or run around the loop in the other direction.)
timz wrote:As you leave Zoo inbound to Upper Level 30th St (using one of the two usual inbound tracks, curving to your right), on your left you can see where there used to be two tracks descending to a tunnel portal between the inbound and outbound tracks. That tunnel joins the tunnel that curves the two tracks from Upper Level southward toward Wilmington. So a train from Pittsburgh could take that tunnel, reach daylight where an R2 train does now, then curve 180 degrees to its left and enter Lower Level 30th St.timz is correct--a westbound train (e.g., New York-Pittsburgh) would have come down the River Line from the Schuylkill River bridge as Amtrak does now and entered 30th St. Lower Level facing south. Leaving, it would do a 180 to join the Suburban Line as if going to 30th St. LL (I meant to say UL) but continue straight through the (now unused) tunnel, joining the present route of the R5 for Overbrook and beyond. By the time they were able to start thinking about it after World War II the only thing headed south was passenger revenues, so they never went through with it.
(No idea whether they planned to take that route or run around the loop in the other direction.)
ExCon90
Last edited by ExCon90 on Tue Feb 17, 2009 3:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.
I take it that the 180 degree arc (curve) would be near where the University City Station is now - although that Arc would be tight on a somewhat short radius. I believe the tunnel in question was the connection for freight to the ""Greys Ferry" yard.
Before 30th St. Station was built as part of this topic's "Plan", the now unused tunnel was for through trains to and from the South that didn't change ends at Broad St. Station. Instead, they only stopped at the West Philadelphia or 32nd St. station, which was along the tunnel, before it got more of a roof, North of 32nd & Market Sts.
If Google Maps can be trusted (and I'll bet it can) the 180-degree bend would be around 650-ft radius, so not bad at all.
The loop track and other improvements are shown in a track diagram in the PRR technical society's book "Trumph III" on page 76. The caption includes comments on the loop and considerations for a "union station" encompassing PRR, B&O and RDG trains.
John Pawson
The Philly chapter of the PRR T&HS published an issue of their magazine on this topic about 10 years ago. You could check their website for back issues.