SEPTA spending 100 million for PTC

[Wingnut]

Ruthby is also the only high speed crossover on tracks SEPTA uses, so having the ability to read indications above approach limited (45 mph) is important. Older equipment has to take Ruthby at 45 because that's the highest non-clear aspect they can display.

I've read somewhere the Amtrak was considering high speed crossovers for some of the interlockings being replaced between Paoli and Philadelphia. Does anybody know if that is the case?

[nomis]

file photo

[amtrakowitz]

Do not get started on how there are better things SEPTA can spend this money on. They have no choice but to install the system.

They could get together with other railroads and sue Congress over this matter. After all, the genii in DC are basing this knee-jerk reaction on the failings of Veolia, who were so bad at operating the trains in the United Kingdom (when called Connex) that they were kicked out of the country.

[Patrick Boylan]

Ruthby is also the only high speed crossover on tracks SEPTA uses

That's surprising to me, I'd assume there are many other crossovers between Newark De and Trenton, which are tracks SEPTA uses. Are you saying that Ruthby's the only one of them that's high speed?

Also in the early 1980's I went on a Philly National Railway Historical Society sponsored tour of the then under construction airport line, and even after these several decades I specifically remember the tour guide saying all the crossovers were high speed, but I think he also said his definition of high speed was 45 miles per hour.

[Matthew Mitchell]

They could get together with other railroads and sue Congress over this matter.

Suing Congress requires some kind of evidence that Congress did something contrary to the law. Lobbying Congress and the FRA for changes in the PTC regulations is more appropriate, and in fact is being done (to no avail so far) by the AAR and APTA.

After all, the genii in DC are basing this knee-jerk reaction on the failings of Veolia, who were so bad at operating the trains in the United Kingdom (when called Connex) that they were kicked out of the country.

I wouldn't tar all Veolia people for the irresponsibility of one Metrolink engineer, but yes, the regs are a knee-jerk reaction to that collision.

[Wingnut]

That's surprising to me, I'd assume there are many other crossovers between Newark De and Trenton, which are tracks SEPTA uses. Are you saying that Ruthby's the only one of them that's high speed?

Also in the early 1980's I went on a Philly National Railway Historical Society sponsored tour of the then under construction airport line, and even after these several decades I specifically remember the tour guide saying all the crossovers were high speed, but I think he also said his definition of high speed was 45 miles per hour.

I'm not completely sure about Morrisville. But all other switches SEPTA normally uses on the Trenton, Thorndale, and Wilmington lines are for 45 mph or less. And SEPTA has no plans to install anything faster than 45 mph switches on their own territory, lol!

I don't know if there's an "official" definition for high speed track switches. But I consider any #20 turnout (45 mph) or shorter a conventional switch as moving point frogs are optional for those. On high speed turnouts over #20/45 mph, a moving point frog is mandatory because then the gap in the frog for straight through movements would be too long. Well, that's for a standard turnout from a straight track. I don't know about equilateral turnouts because they don't have many of those in SEPTA land. The MBTA and LIRR like them, though, because they're prominent on the main trunk of the Old Colony Lines and Queens Interlocking on the LIRR Main Line.

[ThirdRail7]

That's surprising to me, I'd assume there are many other crossovers between Newark De and Trenton, which are tracks SEPTA uses. Are you saying that Ruthby's the only one of them that's high speed?

I'm not completely sure about Morrisville. But all other switches SEPTA normally uses on the Trenton, Thorndale, and Wilmington lines are for 45 mph or less. And SEPTA has no plans to install anything faster than 45 mph switches on their own territory, lol!

Morris is not equipped with high speed crossovers. Ruthby is the only one that Septa uses...not that it does them any good. Perhaps when the SEPTA fleet is equipped with the appropriate cabs, 4-3 at Holly will be upgraded. We consider high speed above 45mph. 60 is the lowest we have.

[Jersey_Mike]

Someone is mistaking the movable point frogs installed at MORRIS for high speed turnouts. RUTHBY is the only HST in SEPTA territory. While 60mph HST's do exist, don't expect Amtrak to use many of them as the 80 Cab Speed code is backwards compatible with the 4 aspect cab signal system and uses a standard 120ppm code generator. 60 requires a 270ppm code unit.

[ekt8750]

So SEPTA's going to be adopting ACSES on their railroad noted in the 2013 Capital Budget. Makes perfect sense since Amtrak is running the same system:

http://www.septa.org/reports/pdf/budget ... l-cb13.pdf

In addition, an Advanced Civil Speed Enforcement System (ACSES) will be layered onto the ATC on all SEPTA-owned
Regional Rail lines. Working in unison, these two systems will provide the functionality of a Positive Train Control System (PTC) that
the “Rail Safety Improvement Act of 2008” has mandated to be operational by December 31, 2015. The PTC will enhance the ATC
System by providing the ability to enforce a stop, enforce civil speed restrictions and enforce temporary speed restrictions through a
network of transponders, while maintaining the continuous track monitoring advantages of the
ATC. The installation of this system will ensure interoperability with Amtrak and the various
freight carriers.

[Suburban Station]

I've read somewhere the Amtrak was considering high speed crossovers for some of the interlockings being replaced between Paoli and Philadelphia. Does anybody know if that is the case?

yes, the plan is to have them all good for 80 mph. when that plan is funded remains to be seen.

[NorthPennLimited]

WMATA just announced DC metro will start running its trains on "auto pilot", 5 years after the rear-end crash at Takoma Park.

http://www.ntsb.gov/doclib/reports/2010/RAR1002.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Interestingly, the NTSB report states SEPTA is one of 5 commuter agencies that uses the same signal system that failed in DC and caused the rear-end collision due to a combination of a track circuit malfunction in the manufacturer's software, and a lack of safety culture to address previous near-misses due to similar problems.

Wonder which part of SEPTA uses Alstom for track signaling hardware?

PTC might be a safety boost from the current "blinking green" signal system on regional rail. Maybe when they scrap the old signal system on regional rail, for PTC, they can give the old system as a hand-me-down to the part of SEPTA that uses the same "scary" system as WMATA.

[Clearfield]

WMATA just announced DC metro will start running its trains on "auto pilot", 5 years after the rear-end crash at Takoma Park.

http://www.ntsb.gov/doclib/reports/2010/RAR1002.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Interestingly, the NTSB report states SEPTA is one of 5 commuter agencies that uses the same signal system that failed in DC and caused the rear-end collision due to a combination of a track circuit malfunction in the manufacturer's software, and a lack of safety culture to address previous near-misses due to similar problems.

Wonder which part of SEPTA uses Alstom for track signaling hardware?

From what I was told, the specific components that failed in DC were not used by SEPTA

[ekt8750]

WMATA just announced DC metro will start running its trains on "auto pilot", 5 years after the rear-end crash at Takoma Park.

http://www.ntsb.gov/doclib/reports/2010/RAR1002.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Interestingly, the NTSB report states SEPTA is one of 5 commuter agencies that uses the same signal system that failed in DC and caused the rear-end collision due to a combination of a track circuit malfunction in the manufacturer's software, and a lack of safety culture to address previous near-misses due to similar problems.

Wonder which part of SEPTA uses Alstom for track signaling hardware?

PTC might be a safety boost from the current "blinking green" signal system on regional rail. Maybe when they scrap the old signal system on regional rail, for PTC, they can give the old system as a hand-me-down to the part of SEPTA that uses the same "scary" system as WMATA.

Isn't DC Metro under rail transit rules and not FRA rules? Also I do believe the ATC and CBTC systems the El and Trolley Tunnel use are both from Alstom.

[25Hz]

Hopefully that will be remedied in the upcoming transportation funding bill. Associations of rail passengers could make an impact by calling members of congress and letting them know its something that can be cut that will actually improve service!

At least it will prevent any more classic Reading substations from being replaced for a while and will hopefully derail their smart card plans as well.

You realize this is a mission critical thing that needs to happen, right? We are one well placed power surge on a weird weather day away from a huge chunk of RRD going dead. They do not sell these autotransformers at kmart, you know... Here's hoping you were being sarcastic...

[Clearfield]

They do not sell these autotransformers at kmart, you know... Here's hoping you were being sarcastic...

You are correct. All Reading autotransformers need to be custom fabricated. Lead time for delivery is one year at a cost of One Million Dollars. They are NOT in any way interchangeable with the PRR side transformers.