SEPTA overcrowding on Regional Rail

[maddoxdy]

Quakertown should be running at this point, but again politicos asleep at the wheel. However, it's less likely that there would be more phila bound commuters from Quakertown than Newtown/Southampton. If/When Quakertown gets done, it should connect to Bethlehem/Allentown so Lehigh County pitches in some of the cost.

From what I've heard, (warning 2nd & 3rd hand info) Bucks Commissioners had no interest in supporting service to Quakertown. The other obstacle is the Perkasie Tunnel. It's roof is not in good shape to risk passenger trains through it. I would love to have train service as I live a half mile from the Perkasie Station.

[SCB2525]

I meant the set of NJT comets that SEPTA bought off them in 08(?). Are they scrapped?

We are not going to get any aem7's.

So that whole potential deal fell through?

[zebrasepta]

I meant the set of NJT comets that SEPTA bought off them in 08(?). Are they scrapped?

We are not going to get any aem7's.

So that whole potential deal fell through?

you should ask BuddSilverliner269 on the issue of Amtrak's aem-7s
25hz is as reliable as a old windows 95 computer

[F-line to Dudley via Park]

I meant the set of NJT comets that SEPTA bought off them in 08(?). Are they scrapped?

We are not going to get any aem7's.

So that whole potential deal fell through?

you should ask BuddSilverliner269 on the issue of Amtrak's aem-7s
25hz is as reliable as a old windows 95 computer

Check the Amtrak forum. Latest rumor from Amtrak employees is that 6 AEM-7AC's are SEPTA-bound. Of course, since those were the remanufactured units they will be the last to be retired...but they are in decent condition. It's the unrebuilt AEM-7DC's that are going straight to the razorblade factory.

28 out of 29 AEM-7AC's are still in service. I don't know why SEPTA was picking up only 6; maybe that'll expand out when more AMTK units get retired. They'd be better off just replacing all their electric locos including the ALP-44 a full fleet of AEM-7AC's and get out of having to maintain the DC traction motors. In light duty on SEPTA the AC's are fresh enough to last another decade or more.


NJT is not getting rid of EMU's at all. That's also incorrect info. Check the thread on the NJT forum about their recently released fleet plan. Aggressive purging of all single-level vehicles for more MLV coaches AND MLV EMU's, to be procured by 2020. And not a straight 1:1 replacement, either. The fleet plan wasn't specific on that point, but hinted towards an uneven displacement with some EMU's eating some Comets. And a goal of rebalancing their full fleet by netting equal seating capacity out of somewhat fewer number of cars in the total/all-vehicle fleet (and then obviously adding to the order for whatever % anticipated expected growth is needed).

On the EMU side, would seem to suggest they're looking for Bombardier to make self-propelled married pairs out of the same MLV carbody with same exact seating configuration. As that order's going to be at least 250 units if not considerably more, SEPTA's probably going to want to take a close look at what NJT is cooking up in case glomming onto NJT's order that proves to be a cheaper/faster alternative than going through the pain and/or tragicomedy of doing a homegrown Silverliner VI design. If they don't care about ordering cars with straight NJT specs like MARC did when it took a bunch of as-is NJT-spec MLV's, the R&D and testing all gets done on NJT's dime.

Nobody's rehabbing the Arrows again. NJT is making this move in part because they studied another Arrow remanufacture and it just wasn't worth the excessive cost. They're old. They aren't frequency-agile. Parts are getting scarce. If total remanufacture is as costly as buying new, you're better off buying new. They aren't a viable re-sale option for what would have to be done to them to eke out an extended service life.

[chuchubob]

Perhaps retired B&O bilevels "Ohio" and "Maryland" might be available.

[jackintosh11]

http://www.septa.org/service/2014-messa ... iders.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; The sooner we can get new locomotives, the better. This is the second time this month.

[jackintosh11]

Also, those Comet 1s are still sitting in overbrook yard, as I observed today. They're old, but couldn't SEPTA get them into usable condition and either add cars to existing sets by breaking up one of the current sets or just making a new set? Most of them look pretty good but there are a few that got tagged.

[nomis]

The Comets were kept as a captive set because they were incompatible to be run with the Bomber cars we have ...

Pick if would would rather have: an extra PP set with a greater probability of a loco failure ... or a loco that can hopefully get some attention at frazier and reduce the loco failures that have been occurring recently.

[25Hz]

Old, tired, second hand locos for RRD vs brand new state of the art...... If this -rumor- is true then .. i don't even know. Nothing i have read or heard anywhere has suggested this to be the plan.

I'm done using logic when it comes to SEPTA fleet management. -rage quit-

[jackintosh11]

The Comets were kept as a captive set because they were incompatible to be run with the Bomber cars we have ...

Pick if would would rather have: an extra PP set with a greater probability of a loco failure ... or a loco that can hopefully get some attention at frazier and reduce the loco failures that have been occurring recently.

I mean putting the comets into service and breaking up a bomber set and making the other bomber sets longer.

[F-line to Dudley via Park]

Old, tired, second hand locos for RRD vs brand new state of the art...... If this -rumor- is true then .. i don't even know. Nothing i have read or heard anywhere has suggested this to be the plan.

I'm done using logic when it comes to SEPTA fleet management. -rage quit-

The AEM-7AC's were remanufactured (not rehabbed, remanufactured) in 1999. The AC propulsion, transformers, HEP power source, and cabs installed by Alstom in the rebuild are all the same age as the "newer" Amtrak HHP-8's and a hell of a lot more reliable, and they got retrofitted with regenerative braking. They're way higher-performance and much more reliable than the AEM-7DC and ALP-44 rolling ruins, as well as having more parts availability than the old stuff. Given the price and how little miles SEPTA's push-pull sets rack up during the day, that is a way better deal than trying to fund new-for-new's-sake locomotives and a new coach fleet at the same time. They can plunk down for a good-sized order of MLV coaches, take the remans and possibly extend out their Amtrak order to not only replace theirs but buff out the fleet with extras (AMTK's never going to find commuter rail buyers for all 28 remans). To-do's they would not be able to pay for if they were tacking on to the end of the ACS-64 order.


If you're going to "rage quit" because they don't look shiny and aerodynamic enough for your aesthetic OCD, I suggest you get off your high horse and look at the big picture. They don't have funding to buy all-new locos, all-new coaches, and expand the push-pull fleet all at once. So how to you maximize those dollars? Amtrak remans get you a solid 10 years of reliable use at bargain-basement price, you can buy more of them than you ever could all-new units, you can apply more of the savings to the replacement coach fleet, and you can apply more of the savings to expanding the coach fleet and netting more total push-pull sets to ease overcrowding. Which--pardon me if I may be mistaken--seems to be the whole point of this thread.

[ex Budd man]

Old, tired, second hand locos for RRD vs brand new state of the art...... If this -rumor- is true then .. i don't even know. Nothing i have read or heard anywhere has suggested this to be the plan.

I'm done using logic when it comes to SEPTA fleet management. -rage quit-

The AEM-7AC's were remanufactured (not rehabbed, remanufactured) in 1999. The AC propulsion, transformers, HEP power source, and cabs installed by Alstom in the rebuild are all the same age as the "newer" Amtrak HHP-8's and a hell of a lot more reliable, and they got retrofitted with regenerative braking. They're way higher-performance and much more reliable than the AEM-7DC and ALP-44 rolling ruins, as well as having more parts availability than the old stuff. Given the price and how little miles SEPTA's push-pull sets rack up during the day, that is a way better deal than trying to fund new-for-new's-sake locomotives and a new coach fleet at the same time. They can plunk down for a good-sized order of MLV coaches, take the remans and possibly extend out their Amtrak order to not only replace theirs but buff out the fleet with extras (AMTK's never going to find commuter rail buyers for all 28 remans). To-do's they would not be able to pay for if they were tacking on to the end of the ACS-64 order.


If you're going to "rage quit" because they don't look shiny and aerodynamic enough for your aesthetic OCD, I suggest you get off your high horse and look at the big picture. They don't have funding to buy all-new locos, all-new coaches, and expand the push-pull fleet all at once. So how to you maximize those dollars? Amtrak remans get you a solid 10 years of reliable use at bargain-basement price, you can buy more of them than you ever could all-new units, you can apply more of the savings to the replacement coach fleet, and you can apply more of the savings to expanding the coach fleet and netting more total push-pull sets to ease overcrowding. Which--pardon me if I may be mistaken--seems to be the whole point of this thread.

Ouch!

[Push&Pull Master]

Couldn't SEPTA like suggested earlier just order some of those Multilevel EMUs that NJT intends in buying? They would increase capacity greatly and would avoid having to increase service. I know acceleration wouldn't be that great but I think it's worth it for the capacity.

[Clearfield]

Couldn't SEPTA like suggested earlier just order some of those Multilevel EMUs that NJT intends in buying? They would increase capacity greatly and would avoid having to increase service. I know acceleration wouldn't be that great but I think it's worth it for the capacity.

I probably missed this, but what manufacturer has designed and built a bi-level EMU that runs under 11KV catenary? It would solve a number of problems for SEPTA.

[Push&Pull Master]

You're right. It hasn't been designed yet but NJ Transit is spending $5 million on designing it. I'll leave it at that to those with more knowledge about this on the forum.