Grow America Act

[jackintosh11]

But are they in good shape otherwise? I would think that SEPTA shouldn't replace 10 year old trolleys. Maybe keep them and pool them with the new trolleys as a nostalgia thing.

[BPP1999]

Replacing trolleys prematurely helps keep SEPTA from having to deal with that pesky concept known as restoration of service.

[SCB2525]

I had heard that the explanation was that they were having a tough time with body corrosion. I could buy that except for the fact that they're being run by San Francisco, Boston and various museums with nowhere near the level of overhaul.

To be fair, the advertised extension of useful life from the PCCII program was only ever 15 years.

[Suburban Station]

Replacing trolleys prematurely helps keep SEPTA from having to deal with that pesky concept known as restoration of service.

quite the opposite, the sooner they are replaced the sooner SEPTA will have fewer excuses to ignore restoration of service. more to the point, SEPTA does not have enough PCC's to run the line, particularly when it's restored to port richmond. second, the current configuration may have a few more "useful" years but the design doesn't allow them to operate on schedule which, for those of us that use it, is a pretty big annoyance. the K cars are exempt from ADA so they do not suffer from this issue though I suspect that low level cars would alleviate some boarding issues on those cars at rush hour (even if it would introduce new ones by making them accessible).

jack-they are not suitable for every day service on a busy line I don't think. I would love if the new order could somehow retain the look and feel of those trolleys yet introduce modern design. trying to find a use for them wouldn't be the end of the world. maybe a west philadelphia circulator using mostly existing tracks?

[trackwelder]

I had heard that the explanation was that they were having a tough time with body corrosion. I could buy that except for the fact that they're being run by San Francisco, Boston and various museums with nowhere near the level of overhaul.

To be fair, the advertised extension of useful life from the PCCII program was only ever 15 years.

frisco and all the other cities bought the cars in the best shape first and started working their way back. the pcc II's are what was left, the absolute bottom of the barrel, condition wise. they've got other problems, too, mostly due to brookville's inexperience at the time as a builder of streetcars.

[CComMack]

I used to think that the PCC-IIs were a bad solution to the Girard Avenue question. Then I moved up to Girard Avenue and found out how much worse the reality was. The PCC-IIs need to be retired as soon as is remotely feasible. They are far too unreliable, and far too over capacity, for the Girard corridor, and both of those problems will only get worse when Port Richmond service is restored and as Sharswood and Olde Kensington redevelop.

[trackwelder]

I used to think that the PCC-IIs were a bad solution to the Girard Avenue question. Then I moved up to Girard Avenue and found out how much worse the reality was. The PCC-IIs need to be retired as soon as is remotely feasible. They are far too unreliable, and far too over capacity, for the Girard corridor, and both of those problems will only get worse when Port Richmond service is restored and as Sharswood and Olde Kensington redevelop.

agreed. it's a damn shame, too. they're very attractive cars, and i think the old PTC paint scheme beats the hell out the plain jane septa scheme.

[Suburban Station]

I used to think that the PCC-IIs were a bad solution to the Girard Avenue question. Then I moved up to Girard Avenue and found out how much worse the reality was. The PCC-IIs need to be retired as soon as is remotely feasible. They are far too unreliable, and far too over capacity, for the Girard corridor, and both of those problems will only get worse when Port Richmond service is restored and as Sharswood and Olde Kensington redevelop.

agreed. it's a damn shame, too. they're very attractive cars, and i think the old PTC paint scheme beats the hell out the plain jane septa scheme.

seems like there's no reason the paint scheme and possibly even the classic design couldn't be implemented on modern streetcars to some extent. If they get the trolley order right it could really make the service more useful though they still need to give trolleys exclusive right if way east of broad and out by the zoo.