Lackawanna Cutoff Passenger Service Restoration

[Dcell]

For those of you interested in history, attached is a story from 2015:
https://www.nj.com/traffic/2015/01/cons ... ounty.html

[lensovet]

The Hudson Farm Culvert easement issue was also resolved about a year or so ago.

Yes and remember that they can't do any construction April-November, that the tunnel has since deteriorated and needs additional design work, and that they want to do the tunnel and station work in parallel. So, practically speaking, the only thing they can do is finish up the design work and hopefully do as much as they can before April 2021 before they have to put things on hold again until November.

though you're right, the tentative agreement was announced in April 2018, so almost two years ago now. the andover website is quite useless and their meeting notes are completely lacking in detail (e.g. https://www.ecode360.com/documents/AN20 ... 999496.pdf simply says "Ms. Blackburn provided an update on train station matters."), so unclear when the "tentative" agreement was actually finalized.

[Statkowski]

I wonder how many people here, other than myself, actually experienced riding over the Lackawanna Cutoff via the Phoebe Snow or Lake Cities.

[JoeG]

I have, at least 4 roundtrips on the Cutoff, two on Phoebe. They had postcards in the observation car that you could address and put in a box. The railroad stamped and mailed them. But at the time a postcard's postage was only 1 or 2 cents.

[Gilbert B Norman]

Me too, Sgt.

And like Mr. Grossman, used the postcards and mail drop in Miss. Phoebe's Obs.

[Statkowski]

Breakfast (or lunch?) in the diner passing through Newark, N.J. heading westward, liquid refreshment in the observation tavern lounge car out of Scranton, Pa. returning eastward. The only way to travel.

[photobug56]

Beats Martz sitting next to someone really big, etc. any day.

[Jeff Smith]

I'm all for discussion, and rarely lock topics any more. We're a discussion! forum, right? But when we get off into fantasy land, and talk about projects not within the scope, or there's been no movement on a project, or all of the above, I will throw a lock on a topic. It's not going to be Amtrak, and it's not going to BInghamton or Chicago or East BumF*ck. I'm all for driving traffic, but for now we're going to call a halt. Please email a moderator or admin if there are current developments.

[Jeff Smith]

Some dated news: https://www.citizensvoice.com/opinion/p ... -1.2607306

Passenger rail service still in question

A new cost assessment for reconnecting railroad tracks in Pennsylvania with those in New Jersey, as a prerequisite for re-establishing passenger rail service between Scranton and the New York area, has gladdened passenger rail proponents.

The new Lackawanna Cutoff Restoration Commuter Rail Study projected the cost of restoring 21 miles of missing track at

$228.93 million. That’s a big number but only about 52% of the $551 million estimated by a 2006 study.
...
The new study covers track construction along 21 miles of the Lackawanna Cutoff, an engineering marvel of its day that tamed hostile terrain and made train service possible. That stretch runs from the Lackawanna Viaduct on the Delaware River to Andover, New Jersey, where New Jersey Transit has restored tracks and plans to open a new station in 2025. The new study also covers rehabilitation of the Lackawanna Viaduct and two other bridges, two train stations and signals for the entire stretch.

The earlier study included the costs of eight train stations, two maintenance depots and track restoration all the way to Scranton.
...

[photobug56]

I don't believe it included rolling stock, though.

[njtmnrrbuff]

Sussex County is a nice county to live and visit. It's been a little while since I have been there. I'm sure that the residents who live in Newton as well as some of the surrounding towns will drive to Andover to get the train. When this service begins to Andover, we hope that the trains that serve Andover aren't all stops locals. At the very least, hopefully these trains will run express from NWK to Summit. When and if Gateway ever gets done, then hopefully the cutoff route will be restored to at least East Stroudsburg. This would help take traffic off of I-80. Following the Covid-19 pandemic, there might not be as many people commuting from Northeastern PA to NYC and back five days a week. That's a rather long commute to be doing that. Even in better times, not everyone commutes daily from NEPA or a lot of Warren County, NJ to NYC. In general, it's not easy getting to a commuter rail station from Sussex County. If you are around High Point State Park, Pt. Jervis is very close but the train ride takes too long. I think if you are in Vernon, then Middletown-Town of Walkill Station is the closest.

[CentralValleyRail]

Sussex County is a nice county to live and visit. It's been a little while since I have been there. I'm sure that the residents who live in Newton as well as some of the surrounding towns will drive to Andover to get the train. When this service begins to Andover, we hope that the trains that serve Andover aren't all stops locals. At the very least, hopefully these trains will run express from NWK to Summit. When and if Gateway ever gets done, then hopefully the cutoff route will be restored to at least East Stroudsburg. This would help take traffic off of I-80. Following the Covid-19 pandemic, there might not be as many people commuting from Northeastern PA to NYC and back five days a week. That's a rather long commute to be doing that. Even in better times, not everyone commutes daily from NEPA or a lot of Warren County, NJ to NYC. In general, it's not easy getting to a commuter rail station from Sussex County. If you are around High Point State Park, Pt. Jervis is very close but the train ride takes too long. I think if you are in Vernon, then Middletown-Town of Walkill Station is the closest.

They should run it up the MNBTN Line calling at MSU-Wayne-Denville then local. (but we all know that won't happen)

[JasW]

The NJT 10 Year Plan came out three weeks ago, but this piece from today points out the fact that it contains no money for going beyond Andover.

PA: No new money for NYC passenger train in New Jersey plan

The proposed Scranton to Hoboken, New Jersey, passenger train may have hit the end of the line. Or just stalled for years of more waiting.

By Borys Krawczeniuk
Source The Times-Tribune, Scranton, Pa. (TNS)
Jun 30th, 2020

Jun. 29--The proposed Scranton to Hoboken, New Jersey, passenger train may have hit the end of the line.

Or just stalled for years of more waiting.

New Jersey Transit, which would operate the train, recently issued a 10-year transportation plan that has no new dollars for extending service on the Lackawanna Cutoff beyond Andover, New Jersey. The agency's plan calls for spending $1.845 billion on three other service expansion projects, but not the remaining 21 miles on the cutoff between Andover and the Delaware Water Gap.

"There are no plans at this point to extend the project beyond Andover," New Jersey Transit spokeswoman Lisa Torbic said in an email.

Larry Malski, the executive director of the Pennsylvania Northeast Regional Railroad Authority, and other officials sloughed off the new plan. They continue to seek federal money for the project.

"We need the next 21 miles, and that's what we're going after in the federal appropriation," Malski said. "Once the 21 miles are there, we're in Pennsylvania. We control our destiny."

Read the rest at https://www.masstransitmag.com/rail/new ... ersey-plan

[photobug56]

Not encouraging. And not even trying to get Federal grants plus financial help from PA. And restoring the Cutoff is good for NJ.

[Dcell]

It's over. Roseville Tunnel is in much worse shape than thought and that's why the project has been stopped and the tunnel work not put under contract.