Regenerative braking on the NY subway

Discussion relating to the past and present operations of the NYC Subway, PATH, and Staten Island Railway (SIRT).

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Passenger
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Regenerative braking on the NY subway

Post by Passenger » Thu Oct 22, 2009 12:39 pm

What was the first NYC subway car to have regenerative braking? Was it the R-1/9?

Also, did NYC streetcars ever have it?

Thanks.

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Re: Regenerative braking on the NY subway

Post by Fan Railer » Fri Oct 23, 2009 4:10 am

R10-R68A have dynamic brakes
all NTT cars have regenerative brakes
dynamic and regeneratice brakes are not the same.

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Re: Regenerative braking on the NY subway

Post by Passenger » Fri Oct 23, 2009 7:34 am

Fan Railer wrote:R10-R68A have dynamic brakes
all NTT cars have regenerative brakes
dynamic and regeneratice brakes are not the same.
Yes I know the difference, just not which cars had what. Thank you.

So the R-9 just had friction brakes?

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Re: Regenerative braking on the NY subway

Post by Fan Railer » Fri Oct 23, 2009 5:01 pm

Passenger wrote:
Fan Railer wrote:R10-R68A have dynamic brakes
all NTT cars have regenerative brakes
dynamic and regeneratice brakes are not the same.
Yes I know the difference, just not which cars had what. Thank you.

So the R-9 just had friction brakes?
yes. and they had AMUE brakes as opposed to the SMEE brakes used on the R10-R68A.

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Re: Regenerative braking on the NY subway

Post by R36 Combine Coach » Sat Oct 24, 2009 2:41 am

First with regen systems was the R110 series in 1992.
Since my friend continues to chain smoke nonstop, she is probably an Alco.

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Re: Regenerative braking on the NY subway

Post by Trainmaster5 » Mon Nov 16, 2009 2:07 am

R36 Combine Coach wrote:First with regen systems was the R110 series in 1992.
Which has been non-functional in the R142 cars for about a year or so because it wasn't working as designed. IDK about the other NTT cars though.

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Re: Regenerative braking on the NY subway

Post by Fan Railer » Mon Nov 16, 2009 2:56 pm

Trainmaster5 wrote:
R36 Combine Coach wrote:First with regen systems was the R110 series in 1992.
Which has been non-functional in the R142 cars for about a year or so because it wasn't working as designed. IDK about the other NTT cars though.
what? the last time i checked, the regenerative's on the R142's are working fine.

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Re: Regenerative braking on the NY subway

Post by Trainmaster5 » Tue Nov 17, 2009 12:56 am

Fan Railer wrote:
Trainmaster5 wrote:
R36 Combine Coach wrote:First with regen systems was the R110 series in 1992.
Which has been non-functional in the R142 cars for about a year or so because it wasn't working as designed. IDK about the other NTT cars though.
what? the last time i checked, the regenerative's on the R142's are working fine.
I check every day. The regenerative brake function has been cut-out on R142 cars for about a year. It wasn't working and the Car Equipment Dept. has been trying to come up with a fix for the problem for some time. In the meantime the TOD screens all have the cut-out message displayed when the train is in operation. IIRC there was a notice to all T/Os to NOT cut the circuit breakers back in and that hasn't been rescinded yet.

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Re: Regenerative braking on the NY subway

Post by Fan Railer » Tue Nov 17, 2009 8:58 pm

ok, lemme clear something up, the regen system isn't working, but there are still electric brakes right, cause that's what i mean.

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Re: Regenerative braking on the NY subway

Post by Trainmaster5 » Thu Nov 19, 2009 10:29 pm

Fan Railer wrote:ok, lemme clear something up, the regen system isn't working, but there are still electric brakes right, cause that's what i mean.
They have pneumatic friction braking systems, if that's what you're asking.

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Re: Regenerative braking on the NY subway

Post by Fan Railer » Thu Nov 19, 2009 11:35 pm

Trainmaster5 wrote:
Fan Railer wrote:ok, lemme clear something up, the regen system isn't working, but there are still electric brakes right, cause that's what i mean.
They have pneumatic friction braking systems, if that's what you're asking.
i know that...

what i mean is the electric brake system consists of two sub systems, the regenerative system that returns energy back to the third rail, and the energy dissipating system, which takes the remaining energy that can't be absorbed by the third rail and dissipates it as heat through a series of resistors.
referencing several youtube videos (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ljCV5BZiidE), you can clearly hear the inverters and traction motors functioning as the train decelerates. this means that the electric brake system as a whole still works, however, according to you, the regenerative portion of the system does not, so that would mean all the energy is dissipated through the resistors. Otherwise, there would be no deceleration sound from the electrical equipment, and a LOT of squealing from the friction brakes, which is clearly not the case.

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Re: Regenerative braking on the NY subway

Post by Trainmaster5 » Fri Nov 20, 2009 2:04 am

R142 Braking systems have been squealing for at least the last 6 months. Every night for the last few months 239th St and East 180th-Unionport yards have been transferring cars to 207th St yard for work to be done on the braking systems. I have yet to see a unit come back with the re-gen system in working order. I'm thinking that if one component,(.ie re-gen), is not working as designed the whole braking system suffers as a result, hence the overnight trips to 207th st for work. IIRC the regenerative braking system was one of the core components touted when the cars were ordered so I'm left to wonder how the electrical components actually perform when one of the core specs has been disabled. That would include heat dissipation also.

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