R-1/9 where the conductor stands question.

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Passenger
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R-1/9 where the conductor stands question.

Post by Passenger » Wed Dec 18, 2013 11:42 am

So to open the doors the conductor stands between the cars on little ledges.

Why?

Was it cheaper to build them that way?
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Re: R-1/9 where the conductor stands question.

Post by Kamen Rider » Wed Dec 18, 2013 5:45 pm

Cause that was were they always stood.

IRT equipment.

BMT equipment save for the standards.

IND equipment.

They were always outside.
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Re: R-1/9 where the conductor stands question.

Post by Passenger » Thu Dec 19, 2013 10:52 am

Kamen Rider wrote: BMT equipment save for the standards.
So what was the reson for the design decision in the first place (before the IND)?

It wasn't as if nobody thought of putting them inside.
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Re: R-1/9 where the conductor stands question.

Post by Fan Railer » Thu Dec 19, 2013 1:56 pm

Passenger wrote:
Kamen Rider wrote: BMT equipment save for the standards.
So what was the reason for the design decision in the first place (before the IND)?

It wasn't as if nobody thought of putting them inside.
I believe the reason is somewhat lost to history, but one can conjecture that exterior controls and the footplate setup survived so long because of the inherent advantage of increased visibility for the conductor while operating the doors.

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Re: R-1/9 where the conductor stands question.

Post by railfan365 » Thu Dec 19, 2013 7:01 pm

I concur on the visibility issue. The conductor stood up high enough to have a superior view of the crowds. Starting in 1950, the conductor's safety is a likely reason for moving the door controls inside, with the fleet evolving to full width cabs partly based on that.

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Re: R-1/9 where the conductor stands question.

Post by Kamen Rider » Wed Dec 25, 2013 12:49 am

they had been outside between cars since the days of the first el lines. It, for them, was simply how you did the job.
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ExCon90
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Re: R-1/9 where the conductor stands question.

Post by ExCon90 » Thu Dec 26, 2013 3:00 pm

It may also have had something to do with the fact that there were no through door controls in the early days; doors in each car were controlled from that car. By placing a conductor between two cars, with controls on the outside, one man standing between the cars was able to control the doors in two adjacent cars.

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Re: R-1/9 where the conductor stands question.

Post by Fan Railer » Thu Dec 26, 2013 3:29 pm

ExCon90 wrote:It may also have had something to do with the fact that there were no through door controls in the early days; doors in each car were controlled from that car. By placing a conductor between two cars, with controls on the outside, one man standing between the cars was able to control the doors in two adjacent cars.
Yes. This is true. I believe the first cars in the system equipped with trainline door controls were the BMT Standards, which makes sense as to why they were also the first cars in the system to introduce interior door controls for the conductors.

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Re: R-1/9 where the conductor stands question.

Post by Paul1705 » Fri Dec 27, 2013 5:00 pm

It looks really dangerous. However, during the 1970s, I don't remember any news reports about conductors falling between the cars. I assume that's because of good crew training?

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Re: R-1/9 where the conductor stands question.

Post by Head-end View » Sat Dec 28, 2013 8:59 pm

Hmmm.......I had never considered the lack of trainline for the doors. I always just figured it was for visibility. But I thought when the R-1's were built in the 1930's that trainlne door control already existed by that time, or am I mistaken? Anyone here know for sure when trainline for the doors was introduced and cars retrofitted?

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Re: R-1/9 where the conductor stands question.

Post by ExCon90 » Sun Dec 29, 2013 2:30 pm

Paul1705 wrote:It looks really dangerous. However, during the 1970s, I don't remember any news reports about conductors falling between the cars. I assume that's because of good crew training?
As best I can recall, they didn't actually ride outside between stations. They waited until the train was on the platform and almost stopped before going outside; at departure they stayed out there long enough to observe the platform as the train left, and then went inside.

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Re: R-1/9 where the conductor stands question.

Post by railfan365 » Sun Dec 29, 2013 6:06 pm

ExCon90 wrote:
Paul1705 wrote:It looks really dangerous. However, during the 1970s, I don't remember any news reports about conductors falling between the cars. I assume that's because of good crew training?
As best I can recall, they didn't actually ride outside between stations. They waited until the train was on the platform and almost stopped before going outside; at departure they stayed out there long enough to observe the platform as the train left, and then went inside.
That's exactly what they did. They rode inside while the train was moving, went out as it was coming to a stop, and came back insideonce they had observed the platform for the requisite 3 lengths.

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Re: R-1/9 where the conductor stands question.

Post by Head-end View » Sun Dec 29, 2013 9:56 pm

It still was very dangerous and I'm glad it's no longer done. I used to get nervous watching the conductors do it years ago. Today, it probably would not be permitted by OSHA, the FRA or other regulatory agencies concerned with workplace safety.

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Re: R-1/9 where the conductor stands question.

Post by Paul1705 » Mon Jan 06, 2014 12:59 pm

Yes, I saw them climbing up and down at each stop. The moments they had to observe the platform on the way out of the station seemed the worst, and then they had to step backwards to get back down. And at outside stations the weather was a factor too.

Didn't the R-10s have the same arrangement?

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Re: R-1/9 where the conductor stands question.

Post by Fan Railer » Mon Jan 06, 2014 5:44 pm

Paul1705 wrote:Yes, I saw them climbing up and down at each stop. The moments they had to observe the platform on the way out of the station seemed the worst, and then they had to step backwards to get back down. And at outside stations the weather was a factor too.

Didn't the R-10s have the same arrangement?
I think so, iirc, the first cars on the IND with interior door controls were the R16s.

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