Hartford Line CtDOT New Haven-Springfield - NHHS

Discussion relating to the operations of MTA MetroNorth Railroad including west of Hudson operations and discussion of CtDOT sponsored rail operations such as Shore Line East and the Springfield to New Haven Hartford Line

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Traingeek3629
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Re: Hartford Line CtDOT New Haven-Springfield - NHHS

Post by Traingeek3629 » Sun Apr 28, 2019 1:32 pm

My problem is the time 4450 runs at. Most likely, this train won't be any better patronized due to its proximity to 4452 and it not serving Springfield. Does anyone know why 4452 can't arrive in Hartford at...7:47 instead of 7:27? Those 20 minutes would make a big difference, with people commuting to an 8 AM job in Hartford arriving right before 8, and since it takes 6-12 minutes to walk to most places in or around downtown, people would be right on time.
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njt/mnrrbuff
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Re: Hartford Line CtDOT New Haven-Springfield - NHHS

Post by njt/mnrrbuff » Sun Apr 28, 2019 5:36 pm

Yes, Ctrail Train #4450 runs at a very weird time-too early for most people. If it was extended to Springfield, the ridership would probably be better especially if you work an 8:00 to 4:00 job in Springfield. The bulk of the ridership of 4450, if it ran to Springfield, would probably be around Hartford but it would probably pick up many riders in New Haven. If 4452 were to be moved back, I wouldn't do it too much as arriving into Hartford at 7:47 only opens up margin for error-that is people arriving late to their jobs, especially if that train is tardy. Remember, we have to factor in points such as walking from the train station to the offices. Baybe have the 4450 arrive into Hartford no later than 7:35.

The state can't just put random times of when trains will run, especially on a line where there is still a lot of single track. If these trains are running close to empty constantly, even if they can only operate in the timeslot given to them, then it's time to pull that train from the schedule.

It would help to have a train station in Enfield, especially if you live along the Springfield Line very close to the MA/CT State Line.

lordsigma12345
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Re: Hartford Line CtDOT New Haven-Springfield - NHHS

Post by lordsigma12345 » Mon Apr 29, 2019 2:48 pm

The unfortunate thing is that while the northbound train didn't have good enough ridership, the turnaround southbound train that also as a result got truncated did get people from Springfield commuting southbound from what I've heard, though at least 141 and 495 are still available as alternatives for southbound travellers...

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Re: Hartford Line CtDOT New Haven-Springfield - NHHS

Post by nomis » Thu May 02, 2019 12:14 pm

Today, the canopy over Springfield platform for Tracks 4 & 6 is being installed. It is starting on the west end nearest the freight elevator.
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daybeers
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Re: Hartford Line CtDOT New Haven-Springfield - NHHS

Post by daybeers » Fri May 17, 2019 12:44 pm

I am thrilled to announce the Hartford Line has surpassed half a million riders since launch! I emailed them about the mobile app currently in testing and asked if there was any ridership data published and they said no (not sure why), but they said 482,749 people used the Hartford Line between June 18, 2018 (start of ticketed service, not including the ~21,850 from the first two free days of service) and March 31, 2019, so one could reasonably assume ridership has reached at least 500,000 by now.

Regarding the app, they said it doesn't support real-time train information. I'm not sure why that is, as it seems to me a no-brainer to integrate that with a ticketing app. I know the CTrail trains don't have real-time info, but it could still be offered for the Amtrak trains!

Traingeek3629
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Re: Hartford Line CtDOT New Haven-Springfield - NHHS

Post by Traingeek3629 » Fri May 24, 2019 7:26 pm

First off: 1680 people per day isn't shabby at all, considering that it includes weekend ridership too. That also means ridership in the first full year of service is going to be along the lines of 610,000-630,000, which is slightly above what SLE gets after nearly 30 years of service.

Secondly: Not sure how, but the app transit provides real-time tracking info. It can show me where the trains are at any time, including delays.
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CVRA7
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Re: Hartford Line CtDOT New Haven-Springfield - NHHS

Post by CVRA7 » Tue May 28, 2019 11:13 am

No big surprise with the good ridership numbers vs. Shore Line East. Look at the population along the Hartford Line - much larger than New Haven - New London. Plus the 2-way commuting in/out of Hartford and New Haven and maybe in the future in/out of Springfield as well.
Of course we had this all before - even in the 1970s, especially during the fuel shortage times. Then the state of CT put on a number of commuter buses that were much less expensive than the Amtrak fares so the demand for rail commuter service dried up as fuel supply increased, and commuter-friendly schedules in and out of Hartford disappeared.

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Re: Hartford Line CtDOT New Haven-Springfield - NHHS

Post by Jeff Smith » Tue Jun 18, 2019 11:30 am

https://www.newhavenindependent.org/ind ... ord_line1/
...
More than 634,000 riders have taken the New Haven-Hartford line since it launched last year, Bysiewicz said. “That’s 51,000 more people than anyone projected. The success is astounding and amazing.”
...
The train line’s one-year report paints a slightly less rosy picture of the nascent train line’s finances. According to the DOT, the Hartford Line cost $43.9 million to operate between July 2018 and June 2019, but it only brought in $7.2 million in revenue. “The expenses for these services include, but are not limited to, labor, fuel, rail car lease payments, locomotive and rail car maintenance, station maintenance, snow removal, and ticket vending machine maintenance and support,” the report reads. “The expenses do not include one-time mobilization costs to initiate service.”
...
Next stop, Willoughby
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Stp243
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Re: Hartford Line CtDOT New Haven-Springfield - NHHS

Post by Stp243 » Wed Jun 19, 2019 7:58 pm

Thanks for that link, Jeff. Good ridership numbers from Hartford to New Haven but it looks like there is room for improvement on the north end of the line. According to an article posted on www.masslive.com there were only 11,000ish riders on CTrail in and out of Springfield Union Station in the first year. In the same time period Amtrak saw just under 103,000 riders through Springfield.

Full article here:

https://www.masslive.com/news/2019/06/c ... ngers.html

gregorygrice
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Re: Hartford Line CtDOT New Haven-Springfield - NHHS

Post by gregorygrice » Wed Jun 19, 2019 11:46 pm

There are only 3 CTrail round trips to SPG a day, the rest being covered by the Shuttles, so that's expected. They are there to cover the first and last trains to/from SPG with one in the middle where there would be a large gap in service due to the Vermonter.

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Re: Hartford Line CtDOT New Haven-Springfield - NHHS

Post by Jeff Smith » Thu Jun 20, 2019 9:24 am

Still a lot to do on the northern end.

-Hartford station double track and possible relocation
-double track north of Windsor
-capacity for storage and turns in Springfield
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gregorygrice
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Re: Hartford Line CtDOT New Haven-Springfield - NHHS

Post by gregorygrice » Thu Jun 20, 2019 12:25 pm

Capacity at SPG will return once Platform C is complete and Track 4 is opened. Also to be honest you really only need double tracking up to the location of the new Windsor Locks station (where the old station house is located). Double tracking the bridge and the few miles north of it would be a waste of money that could go towards double tracking Hartford and adding the new Enfield station.

lordsigma12345
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Re: Hartford Line CtDOT New Haven-Springfield - NHHS

Post by lordsigma12345 » Thu Jun 20, 2019 2:35 pm

Has there been any rumblings on seeing a couple additional Amtrak coaches finally arrive for the Shuttles once track 4 reopens?

lordsigma12345
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Re: Hartford Line CtDOT New Haven-Springfield - NHHS

Post by lordsigma12345 » Thu Jun 20, 2019 2:45 pm

Stp243 wrote:
Wed Jun 19, 2019 7:58 pm
Thanks for that link, Jeff. Good ridership numbers from Hartford to New Haven but it looks like there is room for improvement on the north end of the line. According to an article posted on www.masslive.com there were only 11,000ish riders on CTrail in and out of Springfield Union Station in the first year. In the same time period Amtrak saw just under 103,000 riders through Springfield.

Full article here:

https://www.masslive.com/news/2019/06/c ... ngers.html
Ridership on the north end is actually pretty good when you consider that there really aren't any train times to accommodate workers who commute to Springfield in the morning at your typical morning commute times - Springfield is setup fine for intercity Amtrak service and for people commuting FROM Springfield to Hartford or New Haven (or further south,) but we won't know full potential until there is a train available for commuting to Springfield. Also if that figure comes from Amtrak's normal ridership data - that may be total Amtrak ridership for Springfield Station and Amtrak's fiscal year runs September to September so that may be total Springfield Amtrak ridership from September to April. If it indeed that number is merely September to April, the final year end ridership numbers for Amtrak in the fall should be quite good.... Remember that Amtrak in Springfield has not only the HL, but also the Lake Shore Limited and Vermonter-North (Vermonter ridership is assigned to the "Vermonter" account if at least one end of the trip is between HLK and SAB - to the "New Haven - Springfield" account (also Shuttles and through trains in this account) if one end is between MDN and SPG and the other end is anywhere between SPG and WAS, and to the "Northeast Regional" account if both ends are between NHV and WAS.) So for SPG there are three different services you have to look at for ridership.

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Re: Hartford Line CtDOT New Haven-Springfield - NHHS

Post by Jeff Smith » Fri Jun 21, 2019 10:42 am

I had the same doubts about double-tracking beyond Windsor Locks as well. And that's something that can actually proceed. The bridge rehab/double would be fairly expensive. As for Enfield, They should do the southern infill stations first; they already have the frequency to support them.

Regarding Springfield, wasn't or isn't there an issue with storage? Not sure how the additional platform will improve that.
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