Adams Square

[BostonUrbEx]

1963, interesting, that's about the very year Scollay Square and Adams Square stations were closed, right? I'd say it's Adams, and when it closed, the new Government Center/Old Scollay became the new fallout shelter, hence the "Fallout Shelter" sign in the Gov Center headhouse. Obviously the crackers didn't make the move, lol.

The 1963 date for the crackers would make them 45 years old in 2008. Yummy !

Anyone for a little Railroad.net exploration? There will be free snacks.

[GreenLinetoBrooklyn]

Well, now - we seem to have another clue. That first pic is a color photo. It also looks like it has been altered to appear to have a black and white background. The 1963 date for the crackers would make them 45 years old in 2008. Yummy ! Could the rest of the pics be color shifted to B&W ? Still think that it's Adams Square Station and that these are old pics that someone found.

I'm certain that these pictures are his own. The picture that shows the end of the tunnel with the stairs leading to a door has comments from the photog saying he took these shots on a work assignment, which is also how he got down there.

The "Caution Keep Back..." photo also has the caption "Old subway tunnel near the old Scollay Sq. station".

[crash575]

The photos must be recent since they have EXIF data signifying they're digital. The EXIF data also says the photos were edited in photoshop, perhaps to make them black and white.

[dieciduej]

I respected source gave me this info on the photos in question.

"The section of platform in the photos in question is part of the original Lechmere-bound platform at Scollay Sq. When the 1963 tunnel was built, the new northbound alignment cut across what had been space occupied by the original platform. The Brattle loop was made into a much sharper curve, it had formerly cut across were the hot-dog stand and escalator bank is now, before turning north. The original alignment ran under Cornhill St. That is the section that remains, and that is where the curved section of tunnel is. The part that separates away from the present alignment at the south end of the northbound platform is used as an utility room by the MBTA. There is then a cinder block wall that cuts the MBTA utility room off from the area in the photos. You can see the cinder block wall in one of the photos. The platform remaining was very narrow at that end, with the Brattle loop on one side and the through track on the other. That is why that "keep to right" sign is there, because of the narrow width of the platform. To the right of that sign is a wall that was constructed in 1963 and on the other side of that is the existing northbound alignment and platform at Government Center. One of the photos shows the other end of the tunnel ending at another wall which has a small door at the top, behind that door is the space city hall has used for storage, and beyond that is the present city hall garage. Adams Sq. Station was completely demolished when city hall was built. It is not Admas in the photos, but the tunnel heading toward Adams and the small section of the Scollay platform heading toward this original alignment."

I hope that clarifies things.

JoeD

[FP10]

I think I've found two possibilities

First:
http://books.google.com/books?id=j8QpAA ... q=&f=false
Scroll down to page 50 (labeled plate 27, right before the engineers report).

This seems to match the third picture pretty well, because if you notice in it the wall on the right curves away, while the one on the left stays straight. I believe they may have sealed the tunnel at the row of columns and demolished the rest of the station. If you look at the track diagram a few pages above the wall with the door also matches up pretty well with where the rough foundation for city hall is now. This also would make sense why there is a stay back from the line sign when there is no visible station. The lights and box for the overhead even match up.

Another possibility could be on page 44 here:
http://books.google.com/books?id=yEoAAA ... q=&f=false

but I dont think this is it, as there is no station platform and both walls curve.


EDIT: well, i'm wrong, lol

[3rdrail]

I'm certain that these pictures are his own. The picture that shows the end of the tunnel with the stairs leading to a door has comments from the photog saying he took these shots on a work assignment, which is also how he got down there.

Unless it was superimposed, copied, or otherwise played with, that first picture of the yummy crackers had to be originally shot around 1963. Those cardboard boxes are relatively new. Cardboard breaks down, particularly in humid conditions. That area is very humid and those boxes would have completely disintegrated within eight years, nevermind forty-five. There's zero possibility that someone would have taken boxes of crackers that were 44 years old and placed them in new storage down there after keeping them meticulously hermetically sealed for 44 of their 45 years. Now, irregardless if we assume that this pic is part of the tunnel pics or not, note that he has the same "taken on ...2008" note for the crackers shot. Additionally, if this was a work assignment in 1963, and assuming his age to be 18+, he would have to be 64+ years old today, making it harder to believe that these are original pictures. Does anyone know how to contact this guy on Flickr ? I looked, but I can't see a link. Now, what I want to know is, if I go to the trouble of locating these crackers, do I get to keep them like Indiana Jones kept the Crystal Skull ?

JoeD - That sounds accurate. Thank you.

[BostonUrbEx]

I hope that clarifies things.

JoeD

Wow, I almost said Cornhill Street, but I had no idea that the old tunnel swung out that far! This is very interesting because I know if you follow Cornhill down from Gov Center until you hit the stairs, there are some drains and manholes. One grate has a hole in the cement around it and looking down it looks to be a VERY deep and massive space under there. Perhaps this is connected to the tunnel in some way, hmm. Now I'm kinda tempted to go there with a crowbar, pry up the grate and go down.

[bigbronco85]

I'm certain that these pictures are his own. The picture that shows the end of the tunnel with the stairs leading to a door has comments from the photog saying he took these shots on a work assignment, which is also how he got down there.

Unless it was superimposed, copied, or otherwise played with, that first picture of the yummy crackers had to be originally shot around 1963. Those cardboard boxes are relatively new. Cardboard breaks down, particularly in humid conditions. That area is very humid and those boxes would have completely disintegrated within eight years, nevermind forty-five.

I used to screw around inside the old Danvers State Hospital before it was razed, along with some other similar places around MA and even down toward PA and MD, and most all of them had a fallout shelter in the basement somewhere with these crackers. The one in Danvers was pretty big, there were actually two of them in different buildings. They'd have medical first aid kits, jugs of drinking water, toilet paper, everything.
Inside the boxes are metal tins with saltines in them, some others had this weird pink candy. I even know a few people that tried to eat them , the crackers that weren't damaged by rotted tins from excessive water were actually half decent considering how old they were. No, I didn't eat any...haha

[Arborwayfan]

The digital date on a photo in Flikr (or anywhere) only tells when the the digital photo was taken. An easy way to make an old photo digital is to photograph it with a digital picture. I bet the photographer took the picture on film in 196x and then took a digital picture to post in 2008.

[crash575]

While that's true about exif data in general. This exif file says the photo was taken with a Nikon D40X, a digital camera. I emailed the photographer hopefully he can enlighten us.

[MTD]

"The section of platform in the photos in question is part of the original Lechmere-bound platform at Scollay Sq. When the 1963 tunnel was built, the new northbound alignment cut across what had been space occupied by the original platform... It is not Adams in the photos, but the tunnel heading toward Adams and the small section of the Scollay platform heading toward this original alignment."

Given the answers since my last post, I misjudged the original size of Scollay Square/Gov't Ctr.-Green Line station! Did the 1960s makeover made the station (and platforms) smaller? The photos tell me that sacrificing portions of original platform that Gov't Ctr actually shrunk, unless the T made up the lost platform space with a new section.

[Cadet57]

The digital date on a photo in Flikr (or anywhere) only tells when the the digital photo was taken. An easy way to make an old photo digital is to photograph it with a digital picture. I bet the photographer took the picture on film in 196x and then took a digital picture to post in 2008.

You know its just as easy to put film on a computer right? I still shoot T-Max on occasion and scan the negatives onto my computer to archive them. Why would you take a picture of a picture to make it digital? Why not scan the picture or the negative? Chances are if the exif says its from a Nikon D40, it is.

[jwhite07]

Why would you take a picture of a picture to make it digital?

How about if you want to post photos online, but you don't own a scanner? I call that method a "poor man's scanner", and yes I've done it. Works with slides too - just project the image in the usual fashion, and photograph the screen with a digital camera!

I do now own a very nice flatbed scanner that has slide and negative scanning capability as well.

[Arborwayfan]

One reason to use a camera instead of a scanner is that it's better for the original: no squeezing it face down onto the scanner (more of a benefit for books than for single photos, I admit), no sliding it around, no getting a fingernail under a corner to pick it up, no really bright scanner light. Some archives and museums don't let you scan or copy their materials, but do let you photograph them -- or photograph them for you.

But I think the idea of "the poor man's scanner" is probably more common. Or the scanner of the person who has 20 old pictures to digitize and nothing else they want to scan and would just be wasting money and space buying a flatbed scanner.

Anyway, I'm now beyond what I know. Is exif data created automatically by the camera, or do you put it in or change it yourself?

I way OT, I guess, but we are all trying to figure out what year the original images of these tunnel areas are from. Cracker boxes, picture dates, alteration from color to B&W, all these ideas are trying to figure out when we're looking at in case the photographer doesn't clue us in, right? Don't they look pretty rundown to have been taken out of use just a year or two before the pictures -- peeling paint and such? How well were those tunnels maintained in the years just before they were abandoned? Well, or like the El in 1986 and 1987, with just the very bare minumum done to keep them from falling apart?

[Arborway]

Anyway, I'm now beyond what I know. Is exif data created automatically by the camera, or do you put it in or change it yourself?

The camera takes care of it. You can manipulate it later if you want to, but no one I know ever does. There's no reason to.