MARC Trains to add weekend service

[Station Aficionado]

Most of you act like MARC owns the Penn Line and can run its trains at any time it chooses. But MARC doesn't own the Penn Line, they can run trains only after reaching agreements with Amtrak. Weekend trains services around the country usually run at different times than weekday services.
There's usually a cry from late night partiers for trains to run much later no matter how empty the trains are. Few workers are really good at handling many late night, drunk, and demanding customers, just the fear of civil lawsuits alone is plenty of reason to wish to avoid them.
How late does DC Metro run its trains, and isn't that enough?

Stations are open until midnight Sun-Thurs, 3am Fri and Sat, with the actually last arrival/departure times varying by station and line. Which is fine, so long as you live within the limits of Metro service. For comparison, the NY subway is, IIRC, open 24 hours, every day (with a couple of minor exceptions, e.g., the Grand Central Shuttle).

[Arlington]

Service looks good, but I still think MARC is selling travelers short with a 1030 last call. I guess weekend Nats games are in the daylight, but there could be games at the Verizon center not to mention just general clubbing and other events.

I don't think the MTA can afford to be throwing money at "could be" riders on the fringes of the ridership day--not to subsidize the supremely-thin ridership of "clubbing," anyway.

Personally, I think they've nailed it from a bang-for-buck standpoint. As I look at the Verizon Center's 2013-2014 schedule,
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College games are in the afternoon (and fit well with the '"evening rush" schedule), while the pro-sports generally start at 7pm. If a game is 2.5hours elapsed, fans can make a 10:30 northbound Penn line train easily. Some basketball games (those starting at 8:10) would be tight, but maybe they can and (and probably will) hold those, 'til, say, 11pm. Beyond that, its likely a total economic loser for *Maryland* to chase the later night demographic.

Also consider that Saturday air travel cuts off a bit earlier than other days (There's just no demand). Somewhere between (probably) knowing Amtrak ridership by the hour, knowing city event timing, and knowing federal workers, and even weekend janitorial work, I suspect the schedule has pretty much followed the demand.

And remember, this is Maryland's train. It is definitely more important to subsidize the jobs of Marylanders (whether DOD or janitorial) and BWI Airport (as a convenient competitor to DCA), than it is to ensure that DC bars will be able to dangle train service in front of Marylanders to keep the in the District later.

[electricron]

And remember, this is Maryland's train. It is definitely more important to subsidize the jobs of Marylanders (whether DOD or janitorial) and BWI Airport (as a convenient competitor to DCA), than it is to ensure that DC bars will be able to dangle train service in front of Marylanders to keep the in the District later.

Maybe DC citizens will be willing to help subsidize the very late MARC trains. Most likely they won't because they are already subsidizing Metro trains. Maryland gets zero tax revenues from DC bars and grills.

[Amtrak7]

Note: Once weekend service begins, Amtrak won't be cross-honoring MARC passes on weekends.

[Arlington]

Note: Once weekend service begins, Amtrak won't be cross-honoring MARC passes on weekends.

So, backing up, it seems safe to assume that MARC knows from Amtrak what trains its passes were riding, and has planned accordingly.

If, all along, Amtrak has been telling MARC which trains Amtrak was seeing MARC passes on, and in what numbers, then MARC knows *exactly* where its riders' demands are. So as strange as MARC's Saturday pattern of 4:10p, 4:50p and 5:30p looks, it probably is based on historical use by pass-riders on the Regionals at 3:25, 4:25, and 5:25, and perhaps a bit more shift-friendly (if shifts end at 3:30 or 4pm or 5pm)

Further, MARC's 7:50p, 9:30p, and 10:35p seem more fan-friendly and "dinner in town" friendly than Amtrak Regionals at 7:20p, 8:45p, and 10:10p.

[TheOneKEA]

I'm going to take a look at one of the southbound services to D.C. tomorrow and I'm going to see if I can figure out how many passengers are through passengers from Baltimore Penn.

So far I haven't seen very much in the way of TV advertising for this new service, and that combined with the weather suggests that initial passenger counts will be low.

[gp40marc69]

Service looks good, but I still think MARC is selling travelers short with a 1030 last call. I guess weekend Nats games are in the daylight, but there could be games at the Verizon center not to mention just general clubbing and other events. Is any of the cut weekday service being restored?

The other thing is that freight services between Baltimore and DC have their nighttime slots as well. They have to work in between some of the last few southbounds for the night. They used to have an 1130 train that left DC on weekdays but cut it because of the budget.

[TheOneKEA]

I rode the 677 to D.C. and the 688 back, and both trains had at least 100-150 people on board. Each train was formed with one MP36 and three bi-levels. My perception was that the consist had a hard time keeping to the timetable; both trains were consistently 4-5 minutes behind schedule. Both trains had MARC personnel counting passengers and taking a lot of notes about the number of passengers joining at each station.

My initial perception is that the MTA has a very successful service here and that they will have to consider lengthening the consists to 4 cars next spring as the weather improves.

[Amtrak7]

http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/maryla ... 4309.story" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

More than 1,200 passengers boarded MARC trains Saturday for round trips on the first full day of weekend service on the commuter rail line, the Maryland Transit Administration said.

The MTA released figures Sunday showing 2,465 boardings — 1,235 southbound toward Union Station in Washington and 1,230 northbound to Penn Station in Baltimore. The numbers do not include the elected officials, MTA employees and other guests who took part in the kickoff ceremonies Saturday.

9 trains per direction, that's 137 per train on average (obviously some trains will be much busier than others). In terms of loads, it's similar to LIRR weekend Far Rockaway service.

That said, I don't know how well the predictions that ridership will rise will hold true. The weekends between Thanksgiving and New Year's are among the busiest weekends for transit, barring major parades and events.

[dt_rt40]

"That said, I don't know how well the predictions that ridership will rise will hold true. The weekends between Thanksgiving and New Year's are among the busiest weekends for transit, barring major parades and events"

I hope they are willing to stick with it for the long slog. As I've said before, it will take a while to build market awareness, but I do think the potential is there. I still encounter people on MARC, going to BWI especially, who act like they've just found out about the existing service. (i.e., the weekday service) OTOH, we will obviously never reach the popularity of the NJT NEC line, where I've seen must what must have been well over 1500 people leaving Manhattan on a Saturday night at 8pm. Standing room only for a 8(?) car train. I'm worried it will take a few years, though, and a state bean counter will want to cut back the service before it has a chance to become popular.

[TheOneKEA]

I rode the 480 to Baltimore Penn and the 487 back and the train was at least half full in both directions; the 480 was at least 2/3 full. I firmly believe that this service will prosper and that patronage will rise when spring arrives.

The need to serve West Baltimore is going to be a sore spot though, as Track A between WINANS and BRIDGE is pretty terrible. That could affect ridership into Baltimore.

[realtype]

I hope they are willing to stick with it for the long slog. As I've said before, it will take a while to build market awareness, but I do think the potential is there. I still encounter people on MARC, going to BWI especially, who act like they've just found out about the existing service. (i.e., the weekday service) OTOH, we will obviously never reach the popularity of the NJT NEC line, where I've seen must what must have been well over 1500 people leaving Manhattan on a Saturday night at 8pm. Standing room only for a 8(?) car train. I'm worried it will take a few years, though, and a state bean counter will want to cut back the service before it has a chance to become popular.

This. Five years ago when used I MARC to commute daily to College Park, whenever I told people I rode MARC I would get a blank/confused look. These days whenever I bring up MARC most people (in DC) know what I'm talk about, but usually just as the "the train to the airport." Still, that's a huge improvement over a few years ago when the only people who knew about it were the daily commuters.

I actually have the same fears about the service being prematurely cut, especially after they got rid of the late night service (which needs to return), but I wouldn't underestimate the "power of the people" in protesting such a move, especially in this state. When the MTA threatened to close the Boyds, Dickerson, St. Denis, and Jessup stations (which wasn't really all that horrible of an idea for St. Denis) the "community" successfully leaned on politicians to keep them. Same thing happened when they predictably tried to kill 3 of the 5 ICC Commuter Bus routes in a classic bait and switch. So that provides some comfort.

Yeah, the Penn Line will never reach the level of NJT's NEC route, LIRR's main line, or MN's New Haven Line, mostly for the fact that there just isn't enough people living here, but I definitely think that late night service (weekdays and weekends) should be reinstated, and as you said, give it a decent amount of time to grow before killing it.

[CentralValleyRail]

I hope they are willing to stick with it for the long slog. As I've said before, it will take a while to build market awareness, but I do think the potential is there. I still encounter people on MARC, going to BWI especially, who act like they've just found out about the existing service. (i.e., the weekday service) OTOH, we will obviously never reach the popularity of the NJT NEC line, where I've seen must what must have been well over 1500 people leaving Manhattan on a Saturday night at 8pm. Standing room only for a 8(?) car train. I'm worried it will take a few years, though, and a state bean counter will want to cut back the service before it has a chance to become popular.

This. Five years ago when used I MARC to commute daily to College Park, whenever I told people I rode MARC I would get a blank/confused look. These days whenever I bring up MARC most people (in DC) know what I'm talk about, but usually just as the "the train to the airport." Still, that's a huge improvement over a few years ago when the only people who knew about it were the daily commuters.

I actually have the same fears about the service being prematurely cut, especially after they got rid of the late night service (which needs to return), but I wouldn't underestimate the "power of the people" in protesting such a move, especially in this state. When the MTA threatened to close the Boyds, Dickerson, St. Denis, and Jessup stations (which wasn't really all that horrible of an idea for St. Denis) the "community" successfully leaned on politicians to keep them. Same thing happened when they predictably tried to kill 3 of the 5 ICC Commuter Bus routes in a classic bait and switch. So that provides some comfort.

Yeah, the Penn Line will never reach the level of NJT's NEC route, LIRR's main line, or MN's New Haven Line, mostly for the fact that there just isn't enough people living here, but I definitely think that late night service (weekdays and weekends) should be reinstated, and as you said, give it a decent amount of time to grow before killing it.

Was departing DC Sunday on the 6:20pm Amtrak Northbound Departure. The Southbound MARC train had just arrived Union Station 2 tracks over to my left. When I say tons of people got off, I didn't think it was possible to see as many people come off the train. I believe it was a 3 or 4 car consist with 2 engines. At LEAST 400 people got off it maybe more. Weekend service is definitely doing well from the looks of it!

[realtype]

I hope they are willing to stick with it for the long slog. As I've said before, it will take a while to build market awareness, but I do think the potential is there. I still encounter people on MARC, going to BWI especially, who act like they've just found out about the existing service. (i.e., the weekday service) OTOH, we will obviously never reach the popularity of the NJT NEC line, where I've seen must what must have been well over 1500 people leaving Manhattan on a Saturday night at 8pm. Standing room only for a 8(?) car train. I'm worried it will take a few years, though, and a state bean counter will want to cut back the service before it has a chance to become popular.

This. Five years ago when used I MARC to commute daily to College Park, whenever I told people I rode MARC I would get a blank/confused look. These days whenever I bring up MARC most people (in DC) know what I'm talk about, but usually just as the "the train to the airport." Still, that's a huge improvement over a few years ago when the only people who knew about it were the daily commuters.

I actually have the same fears about the service being prematurely cut, especially after they got rid of the late night service (which needs to return), but I wouldn't underestimate the "power of the people" in protesting such a move, especially in this state. When the MTA threatened to close the Boyds, Dickerson, St. Denis, and Jessup stations (which wasn't really all that horrible of an idea for St. Denis) the "community" successfully leaned on politicians to keep them. Same thing happened when they predictably tried to kill 3 of the 5 ICC Commuter Bus routes in a classic bait and switch. So that provides some comfort.

Yeah, the Penn Line will never reach the level of NJT's NEC route, LIRR's main line, or MN's New Haven Line, mostly for the fact that there just isn't enough people living here, but I definitely think that late night service (weekdays and weekends) should be reinstated, and as you said, give it a decent amount of time to grow before killing it.

Was departing DC Sunday on the 6:20pm Amtrak Northbound Departure. The Southbound MARC train had just arrived Union Station 2 tracks over to my left. When I say tons of people got off, I didn't think it was possible to see as many people come off the train. I believe it was a 3 or 4 car consist with 2 engines. At LEAST 400 people got off it maybe more. Weekend service is definitely doing well from the looks of it!

Good to hear!

[TheOneKEA]

I rode the 691 a few Sundays ago and at least 150 people were waiting in line to get on the train, and when it departed it was almost full and standing. I think MARC is going to have to start looking at increasing the train length or service frequency as the weather warms up and road traffic gets worse.