California High-Speed Rail (CAHSR) System

[eolesen]

btw, don't think for one second that this is anything other than a politically-motivated move. the deadline was 2022, not may 2019.

Yeah, no. This isn't politics. It's sound policy being enforced for a change... The completion deadline is 2022, but programs like this have mandatory progress checkpoints along the way, and frankly, CAHSR failed far too many to count.

The first significant FRA risk assessment that CAHSR failed was delivered in December 2016, and was conducted under the Obama administration. It's only gotten worse in terms of schedule and cost.

That's why oversight and governance exist on major programs, be it private business or public agencies -- when it's clear adequate progress isn't being made to the point the job can't be completed, you shut off the funding.

[David Benton]

I think Newsom foresaw this, there was never going to be big federal money coming to Ca with the current president,so took realistic action.

[Gilbert B Norman]

Not sure what "ground" this CNBC produced documentary "breaks", but nevertheless, here goes:

https://youtu.be/Qaf6baEu0_w" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[lensovet]

btw, don't think for one second that this is anything other than a politically-motivated move. the deadline was 2022, not may 2019.

Yeah, no. This isn't politics. It's sound policy being enforced for a change... The completion deadline is 2022, but programs like this have mandatory progress checkpoints along the way, and frankly, CAHSR failed far too many to count.

The first significant FRA risk assessment that CAHSR failed was delivered in December 2016, and was conducted under the Obama administration. It's only gotten worse in terms of schedule and cost.

That's why oversight and governance exist on major programs, be it private business or public agencies -- when it's clear adequate progress isn't being made to the point the job can't be completed, you shut off the funding.

it was also that same administration that chose to give them the extension, because it understood the importance of this project as well as the factors that led to the delays.

Suggest you read the authority's own response which outlines point by point why this move is bogus: http://www.hsr.ca.gov/docs/newsroom/201 ... 030419.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Note that the political games are happening on both sides: it's possible that Newsom intentionally baited Trump just so he could take him to court and serve him up with some more "winning".

[mtuandrew]

Regardless of what political hay Newsom may reap by possibly suing the Federal government and the money they might keep, he mostly just removed an albatross from California’s neck. This frees him and the state to make other HSR arrangements, and to spend money more effectively.

[lensovet]

Pray do tell, what other HSR arrangements do we have in store? Building through nonexistent corridors where land costs $1mil for a lot of 5000 sq ft?

[David Benton]

I don't think there is a cheap way of doing real HSR.
I was thinking of starting a "can you build a budget HSR" thread in passenger rail , from discussion in the Amtrak forum etc, will do so when I get a chance. Or is it appropriate to discuss here ? I'm thinking practical rather than political obstacles.

[lpetrich]

A California high-speed-rail system has a difficulty that most other proposed US HSR systems do not. California's terrain. The state has lots of mountains in between its two main population centers, the Los Angeles area and the San Francisco Bay Area. Crossing that terrain will be difficult.

Most other proposals have terrain comparable to the Central Valley for most or all of their routes -- flatland or close to flatland.

So it will be challenging for the CASHR's builders to get the money to continue.

An alternative would be to build Merced - Sacramento before the SF or LA connections. Though it would have the advantage of more easy terrain, it would violate the enabling legislation for the system. That is because that legislation specifies connecting to SF and LA before Sacramento or San Diego.

[eolesen]

Legislation can be changed.

[Backshophoss]

With the federal $$$$$$$ gone,CaHSR is DOA,hopefully some of the built sections can be used by Amtrak-Ca services.

[David Benton]

They'll just wait for the 2020 elections. I would think both sides will promise big infrastructure spending then .

[Tadman]

btw, don't think for one second that this is anything other than a politically-motivated move. the deadline was 2022, not may 2019.

This ignores the context that Governor Newsom killed California HSR, not President Trump. President Trump only revoked federal funding for the Modesto section that was going to continue because Governor Newsom didn't want to lose federal funding for previously committed construction. The full route LA-SFO was killed by Governor Newsom. He's the one that decided prior Governor Brown's project was out of hand.

I find that entire state utterly out of line. I just spent a week in LA. All those "environmentalists" that never leave their car and thought I had a screw loose for riding the gold line from LAUPT to Pasadena. It's real easy to talk the talk, not so much to walk the walk. Tell me how they thought it was a good idea to build CAHSR when they don't really have a train to LAX. What kind of sense does that make?

[David Benton]

Thankfully, we have google , so we can find out what these Californians really think and do.

[Tadman]

Thankfully, we have google , so we can find out what these Californians really think and do.

I don't know what that means, but think about it this way: The entire Los Angeles Metrolink commuter system carries about as many commuters daily as one Metra line, despite the LA metro area being twice as large. The LA Metro subway carries about half as many as the Chicago subway carries.

According to US News, LA is the worst city for traffic in the US. San Francisco is third worst.

The talk does not add up. California is one of the worst polluting and least environmentally friendly states, but they love to act all high and mighty and tell us hayseeds in the midwest about how dumb we are.

[eolesen]

Yep. Californians still like their LEED certified sprawling campuses instead of centralized business districts. Guess which is more environmentally friendly?

I've ridden Metrolink and Coaster a few times when visiting our son at Camp Pendleton, and found it grossly underutilized, and only marginally better than sitting in traffic when you look at frequencies and average track speeds.

When they can get up to Metra or LIRR type volumes and frequencies, I'll believe that people would choose HSR over flying or I-5.