Why do LD trains not handle intra-NEC traffic?

[Arlington]

It was much easier when an engine change was happening for all trains there, because they were stopped at the station for a while anyway. Now, the trains are stopped there for about 2 minutes.

Obviously, any split/combine trains would have to dwell longer, but I wouln't say that is much harde. Taking a small hit on schedule would be worth it--the cheapest imaginable way of adding a pseudo-slot on Metro North NHV-NYP would be to tack a section to/from SPG/Vt/Montreal/Inland onto the back of an existing NER, and clearly the NHHS train (or whatever) would have a big padding southbound to ensure that didn't hold up its NER "host".

NERs at WAS have that padding and long dwell, and they've still been a profitable success.

[mtuandrew]

It was much easier when an engine change was happening for all trains there, because they were stopped at the station for a while anyway. Now, the trains are stopped there for about 2 minutes.

Obviously, any split/combine trains would have to dwell longer, but I wouln't say that is much harde. Taking a small hit on schedule would be worth it--the cheapest imaginable way of adding a pseudo-slot on Metro North NHV-NYP would be to tack a section to/from SPG/Vt/Montreal/Inland onto the back of an existing NER, and clearly the NHHS train (or whatever) would have a big padding southbound to ensure that didn't hold up its NER "host".

NERs at WAS have that padding and long dwell, and they've still been a profitable success.

That'd also be the best way to get an Inland Service for semi-free, dropping it off the back of a NB Vermonter at Springfield and picking it up again SB.

(And if you were really slick, you'd attach a BOS - SPG northbound section at the same time as you dropped a SPG - BOS section. It'd require some odd wye action though.)

[west point]

To enable a quick add removal of connecting cars needs what this poster saw in the past.
1. first you need at least a two platform station.
2. Build a connection switch(s) to / from tracks of each platform located close to the center of the platforms.
3. For an equipment drop stop the "A" train with the connecting cars far enough back of the switch to allow a loco(s) to connect.. Drop cars and pull "A" train past fouling point of switch. Then a loco can back from other platform track, couple to back end cars, connect HEP, brake lines, car control, & perform brake test.
4. In the mean time the front section of train "A" can depart and the now "B" train can also depart.
5. Combining "C" & "D" trains enter station on each of the platforms.
6. One train will stop short of the switches and other will pull forward of switches.
7. Then back train will have engine disconnect and pull forward past switch.
8. Then forward train can back to rear train connect all lines brake test and ready to go.
9. One problem is allocating boarding passengers to proper platform.

[Arlington]

Theh December MPR is happy with how the Palmetto has operated on the NEC:

Performance for Long Distance is being positively impacted by the Palmetto, which started to accept local
Northeast Corridor trips in October. Palmetto ridership was 67% above last year, and ticket revenues
were 40% above last year

YTD Palmetto ridership is up 50% and ticket revenues are up 34% (not surprising: the intra-NEC trips are numerous, but shorter and therefore lower-face-value)

This appears to have cut the Palmetto's losses in half, allowing it to pull away from the other LDs and close in on the AutoTrain in terms of payback.

Are there any other "logical" LDs for a similar treatment?

[jackintosh11]

Maybe the Silver Service trains or the Crescent, or the NB Carolinian/SB Palmetto. The Cardinal doesn't run every day, but it does run on Fridays which I believe has high ridership on the NEC, though correct me if I'm wrong. Other than that, there aren't any LD trains that run along profitable corridors AFAIK.

[mtuandrew]

jackintosh: And if I were at 60 Mass, I'd be thinking strongly of adding another Cardinal line to make it daily, and accepting the intra-NEC traffic to cut their losses.

[Arborwayfan]

It sure does seem like suggestion 6 (last-minute sales) would make a lot of sense, with the smart reservation system described, especially now that one can buy a ticket on a phone. Northbound, it makes even more sense. Once it's pretty clear that no one from south of WAS is going to want a seat, why not sell it to whoever wants it further north? By then you're in the NEC and the trains are frequent enough that people do just walk into the station and buy a ticket. Maybe Palmetto will be an example and encourage more, at least more last-minute sales. Maybe get a little more revenue from the diners on the LDs that have them, too.

[David Benton]

jackintosh: And if I were at 60 Mass, I'd be thinking strongly of adding another Cardinal line to make it daily, and accepting the intra-NEC traffic to cut their losses.

They could run the Cardinal consist as far as Charlottesville and return , on the days it sits in New York. No extra equipment needed.

[mtuandrew]

They could run the Cardinal consist as far as Charlottesville and return , on the days it sits in New York. No extra equipment needed.

Worth a suggestion to "them", whether "they" are Amtrak or Virginia DOT. Amtrak would have to cut off the sleepers, but otherwise it'd be nice to institute a thrice weekly 750-751 Cavalier.

[Jeff Smith]

Are you referring to this historical train? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cavalier_(N%26W_train" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;)

[mtuandrew]

Are you referring to this historical train? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cavalier_(N%26W_train)

No - NYP-CVS rather than NFK-CIN - but I'm not surprised that N&W beat me to using that name

[dgvrengineer]

Leave the sleeper on and sell it as business class/private room.

[Arlington]

Leave the sleeper on and sell it as business class/private room.

Sounds right to me. Use the regular consist and just run the diner as a lounge (kitchen dark. Sticking points end up being things like slots on the Long Bridge and cost of a base to turn it at (I vote Lynchburg, actually, as if it were a Crescent stub even though we are saying it is a Cardinal)

[jackintosh11]

What if any time a passenger booked a ticket from south of DC to an NEC station south of Newark, a seat would become available from that station to NYP? That way, it never takes seats away from LD passengers, but lets them sell space that would otherwise go unsold.

[Arborwayfan]

Are the LD trains on the NEC late more often than the Regionals? Amtrak might not want to sell seats on trains are more likely to be late and make passengers angry when other trains are available.