Arkansas and Missouri Centuries near the end?

[Railpac]

Welcome back Casey!
You mentioned that you were looking for new ALCOs to add to the fleet, I assume the A&M has made some line acquistions? I was just wondering, is the A&M looking for more midrange units such as RS-36s, RS-32s, C-420s, C-424/5s, M-420s, and possibly some rebuilt RS-3s? Or is it more interested in heavier six-axle power such as M-630s, M-636s, or even some Bombardier units? It would be interesting to know what you are looking for.

[wess]

Welcome back Casey

[super7cr]

The Quote stated in red on page one was a quote from myself on the LA&L Railroad Forum. Let me assure you the information I received was from a source I deemed reliable. However, that has since been deemed unreliable since Casey has put this to rest.

I NEVER buy into rumors. I was told from someone who used to be very high up at the A&M and a person whom I see frequently. I'm sorry that I issued conflicting information.

I personally hope the ALCo's keep running. Sorry that I issued information that was unreliable. Thanks for your patience.

[Alcoman]

Super7cr,
That can happen to any of us. I know that I have fallen prey to that a couple of times. I am glad that it WAS wrong information...Long Live the Alcos!
We will just chalk that up to experience. No harm done.

Alcoman
Moderator/ Alco Forum

[Alcoman]

This was sent to the Delaware-Lackawanna List as well as the ALCOdiesel e-mail list:

""A&M has other plans for 604 so it is not being scrapped.
Rumour is about some experiment with a 7FDL12/GTA-11
installation."

Here we go again......
from Ed Bowers

[Ol' Loco Guy]

say it ain't so, John...say it ain't so...

[Komachi]

A speculative "Super-seven" swap? Isn't that what the guys at the shops down in Empalme (I'm sure I butchered that), Mexico did to a bunch of the ALCo. units for NdeM (although I think the national railroad was broken up into smaller lines a while back...)? I read it in an issue of Trains back in '93 or '94. I haven't heard/read how well that program worked down there, but they were known for working miracles.

Which now begs the question of why they would swap out perfectly good 251s for FDLs? Is the 7/FDL12/GTA-11 a "Tier-II" compliant prime mover, or is this an experiment to work out the kinks in "transplant surgury" so in the future they can swap in a Tier-II power plant? (I don't follow GE, so I don't know if the 7/FDL12/GTA-11 is the latest thing or not. Although, given the timeline of the Trains article, I'm betting not.)

[Alcoman]

Komachi wrote:"Which now begs the question of why they would swap out perfectly good 251s for FDLs? Is the 7/FDL12/GTA-11 a "Tier-II" compliant prime mover, or is this an experiment to work out the kinks in "transplant surgury" so in the future they can swap in a Tier-II power plant? "

I was wondering the same thing. Besides, I thought shortlines and regionals were excempt from Tier II regulations.
Alcoman

[Komachi]

Okay, did some digging around (probably should have done that first, hmm?) and the GEVO-12 is deffinately different and the "Super-7" program dates from about 1989 or so.

Still, is the 7/FDL/GTA-11 upgradeable to Tier-II standards? Or was it as I speculated, and this is a dry run before they find something better to use?

I'm still currious as to know why they're contemplating it in the first place, other than on environmental grounds, unless the 7/FDL/GTA-11 is a more fuel efficent motor, then I could see economic grounds...

Does this mean that they may also experiment with microprocessor controls and AC traction motors?

[Allen Hazen]

Remember those Conrail C30-7A with the 12 cylinder engines (built 1984)? A lot have been scrapped, with the engines and (GTA-11) generators from some going to re-engine some Australian (ex-New South Wales railway, now owned by a leasing company) that had Alco 12-251 originally. So this sort of thing can happen: I don't know what the Australian pollution control requirements are, but I doubt they would be significantly more lax than the American.
(GE has introduced the 12 cylinder GEVO to replace the 16 cylinder FDL on their top-of-the-line, 4400 hp, Tier II locomotives, but they also, at the same time that they were developing the GEVO engine, put effort into cleaning up the FDL: I suspect that they could, for a price, give you a compliant power package in the 2250-3100 hp range using modified 12 cylinder FDL engines. But I don't know anything specific.)

[wess]

If and when I get the time and money, I,ll try and post the shots I took of the Springdale yard area. Otto if you happen to watching in, I could use some help posting
wess

[Centurylover68]

TRAINS Magazine recently stated that A&M loves its ALCOS and will keep them as long as possible.Besides they tryed GP38s and they didn't have as good a pulling power as the Alcos. The Alcos are perfectly safe as of now.

[Matt Langworthy]

Especially since the parts for the 251 engine are still made by FM and easy to get, as per the article. I gotta get down there- those strings of red Alcos remind me sooooo much of the tracks near Sayre in the mid-70s.

[2spot]

For those of you who dont know, a post on the previous page by C 420 is the answer. Casey is THE guy at A&M. If he says they are keeping the ALCos, then the ALCos are staying. Read his post.

[Ol' Loco Guy]

Especially since the parts for the 251 engine are still made by FM and easy to get, as per the article.

Easy to get ????

How about Expensive !!!!

Don't believe everything you read in that rag.

For the eight millionth time, FM Engines largest customer is GOTUS. 251 parts
(as well as OP, Colt Pielstick, etc) are priced accordingly. BIG $$$$$

Most the remaining Alco locomotive operators do a good job of mining secondary sources of material. If FM was their sole source for parts, those locomotives would be gone in a proverbial NY minute