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  • LV LOCOS. GAS OR DIESEL ?

  • Discussion related to the Lehigh Valley Railroad and predecessors for the period 1846-1976. Originally incorporated as the Delaware, Lehigh, Schuylkill and Susquehanna Railroad Company.
Discussion related to the Lehigh Valley Railroad and predecessors for the period 1846-1976. Originally incorporated as the Delaware, Lehigh, Schuylkill and Susquehanna Railroad Company.

Moderator: scottychaos

 #125783  by GOLDEN-ARM
 
I WAS LOOKING AT A ROSTER, OF LV LOCOS. WAS WONDERING ABOUT THE FOLOWING : LV #10-14 (GE 28 1/2 TON) LV #50-52 (MACK 45 TON) LV# 75,76 (EMC MODEL 60) LV# 99,100 (AGEIR 60 TON BOXCAB) LV #101 (GE/ALCO 71 TON) LV #125 (BRILL 73 TON). THE ROSTER I AM LOOKING AT SHOWS THESE AS DIESEL-ELECTRICS. I WAS ALMOST CERTAIN THE 75 &76 WERE GAS ELECTRICS. I DON'T HAVE ACCESS TO A DIESEL SPOTTERS GUIDE, WHERE I'M AT. JUST LOOKING OVER THIS ROSTER PAGE, AND WONDERING.......ANYONE? THANKS :wink:

 #125803  by scottychaos
 
yep, the model 60's were gas/electric, not diesel.
found this:

"An early EMD boxcab designed for freight operation was their Model 60; this boxcab is very close in shape and appearance to the ALCos. The locomotive is a 400hp boxcab ca. 1930-31 and was equipped with a Winton 148 gasoline engine. Two units, #463 and #464, went to the Lehigh Valley in 1930"
from:
http://home.att.net/~Berliner-Ultrasonics/boxcbemd.html

Scot
 #125947  by GOLDEN-ARM
 
[/iTHANKS FOR THAT ONE, SCOTT. I SAW THAT SITE, AND IT IS FLAWED. IT SAYS THE 2 UNITS BECAME LV463, 464. MY RECORDS INDICATED THEY BECAME THE LV75, 76. THOSE OTHER NUMBERS ARE UNCLEAR TO ME, WHERE THEY ORIGINATED FROM. THAT TAKES CARE OF THAT SET OF ENGINES. ANYONE ELSE, ON ANY REMAINING ENGINES. I AM WORKING OFF AN "ALL TIME LV DIESEL ROSTER", SO OBVIOUSLY, THE ROSTER NEEDS SOME FINE TUNING. THOSE 2 BOXCABS MAY, OR MAY NOT HAVE BEEN RE-POWERED, AT SOME POINT IN TIME, WITH DIESELS, BUT IT SEEMS UNLIKELY. THANKS AGAIN SCOTTYCHAOS. KEEP "FLYING THE FLAG" REGARDS
 #125977  by CAR_FLOATER
 
Scott, G-A, and other interested LVer's.....

Most if not all these engines served the New York Harbor terminal area.....
Brill-GE #125 was the first verified internal combustion locomotive used to replace steam at the E. 149th Street Bronx Terminal, and Mack #111 at the W. 27th Street Manhattan Terminal.
Chuck Youngkurth's "Steam Era Of The Lehigh Valley" is also a good photo source of these pioneer engines.
The roster below is taken from my upcoming article on the history of the E. 149th St Bronx Terminal in the RMIG Transfer, issue #43, to be published fall of 2005 - sorry for the shameless plug!

Car Floater

Listing Of LVRR Small Pioneer Gas Electric And Diesel Switching Locomotives Used In New York Area Terminal Service

Key to Roster As Follows -
As Delivered Road # / Re #'d / Year Delivered / Builder / Model / Bought / Retired

110,111¹ 50,51 1938 Mack 45 Ton 1929 -
112¹ 52 - Mack 65 Ton 1930 -
60¹,61,62 same 1938 GE 44 Ton 1942 -
115,116 75,76 - EMC 60 Ton 1930 1953
100,99² same 1938 AGEIR 60 Ton Boxcab 1925 1947
125 101 1938 Brill-GE 73 Ton Boxcab 1927 1957

1 - Still on Roster in 1960
2 - Bought used from Utah Copper in 1932
Engine's 50, 109,75, 76, 125/101 are confirmed to have worked Bonx Terminal
Roster Sources -
January 1, 1960 Summary of Equipment, North East Rails LV diesel roster, LV 3 by Morning Sun Books, LVRR Modelers Website Model Locomotive Listing,
James Mack's LVRR website gas and diesel roster,Time Books of Ben Wilczewski, collection of Fred Wilczewski and time book collection of Ralph Heiss
 #126081  by GOLDEN-ARM
 
THANKS, FOR YOUR INPUT, MR. C-F. I WILL NOTE THAT ONE SOURCE YOU LISTED (I WON'T SAY WHICH ONE) IS THE LIST I AM TRYING TO FIGURE OUT. YOU GAVE SOME GOOD INFO, BUT HOW ABOUT A BREAKDOWN, GAS-ELECTRIC VS. OIL-ELECTRIC ? (LATER TO BE CALLED DIESELS)NO SENSE CALLING IT A SHAMELESS PLUG. IF YOU PUT IN THE TIME, AND EFFORT TO HELP INFORM OTHERS, IT'S SOMETHING TO BE PROUD OF. (I WILL BE WAITING FOR MY COPY...HINT....HINT !!!) AS I AM WORKING MY WAY THROUGH THE ACTUAL FEAT OF MODELLING THE ALL TIME LV DIESEL ROSTER, UNIT FOR UNIT, I AM STUCK ON THE FIRST PAGE, WITH SO FEW CLEAR PHOTOS TO MODEL FROM, AND THE CONFLICTING DATA, OF OIL VS. GAS POWERED LOCOS. I HAVE TRIMMED THE ROSTER DOWN TO 315 UNITS, BUT I SUSPECT A COUPLE MORE OF THOSE PRE-WAR UNITS MAY TURN OUT TO BE GAS POWERED.LOCOS 10-14, 50-52, 99,100, 101, 125 ARE MY STICKING POINTS, AS FAR AS GAS VS. DIESEL. (THE 125 IS THE FIRST ONE, NOT THE LATER NW-1) EVEN LOOKING AT THE "BOXCAB" SITE LEAVES THIS UNCLEAR, EXCEPTING THE TWO LOCOS I REFERENCED IN THE SECOND POST I MADE. HOPEFULLY I WILL BE ABLE TO START SHOWING THE HO ROSTER, I HAVE DONE SO FAR, ON ED'S SITE, WHEN HE GETS A CHANCE. THANKS FOR ANY RESPONSES. REGARDS :wink:

 #127137  by chnaus
 
Golden arm, with all those locomotives are you modeling just the
Sayre shops ??

Do you want the rest of the 60 roster ??
 #127143  by GOLDEN-ARM
 
GREETINGS, CHNAUS. I AM ACTUALLY MODELLING THE ALL TIME DIESEL ROSTER, ENGINE FOR ENGINE. MY DIESEL ROSTER SHOWS A TOTAL OF 317 DIESEL ELECTRIC ENGINES, ON THE ROSTER, FROM 1922 TO 1974. I WAS ABLE TO ELIMINATE 2 OF THOSE, OFF THE ROSTER, BECAUSE THEY WERE GAS, AND NOT DIESEL. THOSE TWO WERE THE #75 AND 76. THIS BRINGS IT DOWN TO 315 LOCOS I AM DOING. MY QUESTION WAS ABOUT THE LOCOS MENTIONED ABOVE, TRYING TO DETERMINE ARE THEY ALL REALLY OIL-ELECTRICS (DIESEL), OR ARE ANY OF THEM GAS.THE GE, MACK AND BRILL HAVE ME SEARCHING, AS DOES THE AGEIR AND THE GE/ALCO. I SUSPECT THEY WILL ALL TURN OUT TO BE OIL-ELECTRICS, BUT I NEED VERIFICATION. (SCRATCHBUILDING THESE ANCIENT BOXCABS IS A PAIN IN THE B#@&*.) IF YOU HAVE ANY SPECIFIC INFO, FEEL FREE TO SHARE. THERE ARE MORE PEOPLE WATCHING THIS, ALSO CURIOUS ABOUT THIS INFO, WHEN IT IS LOCATED. JUST FINISHED ALL 14 PA'S, AS WELL AS ALL 20 FA-1'S. THIS PUTS ME OVER THE HALFWAY POINT, WITH AROUND 166 LOCOS COLLECTED, DECODED AND LED INSTALLATIONS DONE, TO DATE. (ONE DAY, I MIGHT EVEN BUILD A LAYOUT, TO RUN THEM ON. MY 3 FOOT TEST TRACK GETS OLD, REAL QUICK :wink: ) THANKS FOR YOUR RESPONSE, FEEL FREE TO ADD ANY INFO, THAT MAY HELP. REGARDS :wink:
 #138879  by CAR_FLOATER
 
G-A , hows the roster coming? Still need clarification on the early stuff? Let me know, I'll ask around...

C.F.
 #952885  by jsprague
 
I have a scratch-built box cab diesel in HO scale with a mainly brass body which was black. I have stripped it. I recall seeing a reference to this type with a black and white picture and a description, but where this was printed escapes me. A quick check of the original and second edition of the "Diesel Spotter's Guide" from the 1960's didn't find it there. But if memory serves, it was described as a rather unusual color and the number "13" on the side, but as I recall, although described as a Lehigh Valley engine, did not have that name or the "LV" initials on it. The color was either violet, lavender or purple.