NYC Olympic Bid

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Thomas
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NYC Olympic Bid

Post by Thomas » Tue May 27, 2014 5:59 pm

New York City is expected to bid for the 2024 Olympics.

Should New York City receive it, how will this determine which type of trans-hudson capacity gets built (Seven Subway to Secaucus, New Jersey, or Amtrak's Gateway Project)?

4400Washboard
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Re: NYC Olympic Bid

Post by 4400Washboard » Tue May 27, 2014 6:45 pm

If nyc is to get permission to host the olympics (Which i personally think is highly unlikely :P ), there will probably be (I'm not giving any guarantees):

1. The 7 train to Secaucus would be a somewhat reasonable idea (In my mind) because a good deal of the events would most likely be hosted in Flushing Meadows Park (Problem for me since I'll live on the same lline that all of the goddamn ppl would be using to get to the olympics-OVERCROWDING!!!!!!!). Therefore, it would be much much easier for many New Jersians (Is that how you say it??) to get to the olympics. The problem is MONEY and TIME (Read the first line of my signature). I cannot come even close to predicting how much $ the state(s) would send to the MTA Subway division for the extension, but the project would be VERY expensive to say the least. But with the advent of CBTC coming sometime soon to the 7 line, trains might be able to run faster and run closer together. Thank god for the 11 car trains :P

2. I can't give you much of a good answer for New Jersey and Amtrak Gateway (As it always depends on the $), but I'm pretty sure that Penn Station and Grand Central would receive some upgrades, whether it's switch simplification or expansion.

3. Most likely, all of the cars running through the greater NYC area would get a nice fresh washdown so olympic viewers and olympians would feel inclined to take the trains! But if the MTA has the $, the old old cars may be given the boot or some super major overhaul but again-no guarantees (The R32s and R42s will disappear next year at 51 yrs. and 45 yrs. respectively; the R44SIRTs will turn 53 that year; the R46s will by 49; the R62s will be 41)

4. MNRRs M3As will turn 40 by 2024, but Im going to put out a wild guess that MNRR has plans for them before 2024, but we'll see-same story with the LIRRs M3s

5. For the LIRR diesel fleet i suggest reading these: http://www.thelirrtoday.com/2014/05/cou ... table.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; http://www.thelirrtoday.com/2014/05/the ... iesel.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; Portions give you a good idea of the projected LIRR plans

6. I'm pretty sure PATH will lengthen their trains a bit

7. Acela and Amtrak infrastructure would probably be upgraded to allow faster speeds, etc., funding permitting

8. I can't give you any guarantees on any NJT plans, but they will probably beef up their schedules if possible, along with the LIRR and MNRR (Again if possible)

9. I suggest reading this: http://www.railroad.net/forums/viewtopi ... 67&t=17711" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; regarding PSAS

10. I'm pretty sure amfleets will still be around (But they might be replaced...); I'm not sure about the diesel fleet, but the SSYD would require expansion if more trains come streaming in to lay up there

Just my 2 cents, TJ
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afiggatt
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Re: NYC Olympic Bid

Post by afiggatt » Tue May 27, 2014 7:30 pm

Thomas wrote:New York City is expected to bid for the 2024 Olympics.

Should New York City receive it, how will this determine which type of trans-hudson capacity gets built (Seven Subway to Secaucus, New Jersey, or Amtrak's Gateway Project)?
Moot question as Mayor de Blasio has decided not to bid for NYC to host the 2024 Olympics. The correct decision IMO. NYC does not need the Games to attract more tourists and visitors or to raise its international profile. The city gets millions of visitors every year already and is pretty well known around the world.

But if NYC were to host the Olympics, why would adding transit capacity to New Jersey be part of any transit upgrades for the games? NYC has enough hotel rooms for visitors and would likely have almost of the events take place in NYC or on Long Island, except for events that require multiple stadiums such as soccer.

4400Washboard
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Re: NYC Olympic Bid

Post by 4400Washboard » Tue May 27, 2014 7:45 pm

afiggatt wrote:
Thomas wrote:New York City is expected to bid for the 2024 Olympics.

Should New York City receive it, how will this determine which type of trans-hudson capacity gets built (Seven Subway to Secaucus, New Jersey, or Amtrak's Gateway Project)?
Moot question as Mayor de Blasio has decided not to bid for NYC to host the 2024 Olympics. The correct decision IMO. NYC does not need the Games to attract more tourists and visitors or to raise its international profile. The city gets millions of visitors every year already and is pretty well known around the world.

But if NYC were to host the Olympics, why would adding transit capacity to New Jersey be part of any transit upgrades for the games? NYC has enough hotel rooms for visitors and would likely have almost of the events take place in NYC or on Long Island, except for events that require multiple stadiums such as soccer.
Perhaps more new jersians want in on the olympics and would rather see it in front of their face versus on TV. Perhaps other tourists would rather stay in new jersey, or are forced to due to a rare overcrowding scenario.

Some events could be hosted at Meadowlands (although NJT would need to thoroughly rethink the layout of the station) and other parts of new jersey that NJT serves. Long island is another reasonable possibility, though that would require the 3rd Main Line track asap and various other schedule changes to squeeze more trains in, if that is possible at all by 2024.

Soccer is one of the most, if not the most, popular sport in the world so if they were to use a stadium in New Jersey for a soccer field, NJT better be prepared
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Thomas
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Re: NYC Olympic Bid

Post by Thomas » Tue May 27, 2014 9:55 pm

tjensen wrote:Perhaps more new jersians want in on the olympics and would rather see it in front of their face versus on TV. Perhaps other tourists would rather stay in new jersey, or are forced to due to a rare overcrowding scenario.

Some events could be hosted at Meadowlands (although NJT would need to thoroughly rethink the layout of the station) and other parts of new jersey that NJT serves. Long island is another reasonable possibility, though that would require the 3rd Main Line track asap and various other schedule changes to squeeze more trains in, if that is possible at all by 2024.

Soccer is one of the most, if not the most, popular sport in the world so if they were to use a stadium in New Jersey for a soccer field, NJT better be prepared
Seven Subway to Secaucus would enable a lot of foreigners to get to the Meadowlands (Via the NJ Transit Shuttle) because the Opening and Closing Ceremonies of the Olympics would be there. Now, there is talk of hosting the 2028 Olympics in NYC...

But, I still prefer Gateway.

4400Washboard
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Re: NYC Olympic Bid

Post by 4400Washboard » Wed May 28, 2014 9:53 am

Well 2028 makes all of the theories stated above more realistic (R44SIRTs and R46s will either be gone or almost gone by then for one thing). I don't think any american city will host the olympics given America's current financial situation/
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mtuandrew
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Re: NYC Olympic Bid

Post by mtuandrew » Wed May 28, 2014 1:53 pm

tjensen wrote:Well 2028 makes all of the theories stated above more realistic (R44SIRTs and R46s will either be gone or almost gone by then for one thing).
It doesn't matter what age the equipment is in, especially if it has the same capacity and is in reasonably good shape. It's far more important that passengers get where they need to go, and that the stations and physical infrastructure (above and below the rail) is in tip-top shape, in my opinion.
tjensen wrote:I don't think any american city will host the olympics given America's current financial situation/
Saying "America's" current financial situation is an overgeneralization, I think! The Northeast may not have fully recovered from the series of body blows dealt it, from the 1950s onward to the recent recession, but go to a place like Dallas and you'll see a boomtown that's having a hard time even containing its massive growth. I wouldn't be surprised if the DFW area puts in a bid one of these years.

As for the original post, I'd look for PANYNJ to actually assemble (or be a lead partner) on any future NYC-area Olympic bid. The city would undoubtedly host many (most?) events and be another lead partner, but the Port Authority would be able to use and create venues in the Meadowlands, Long Island, and elsewhere in the bi-state area. Transit would be inevitable and invaluable, and PATH and AirTrain would be just two small pieces in that puzzle.

David Benton
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Re: NYC Olympic Bid

Post by David Benton » Sun Jun 01, 2014 1:37 am

I would think that bids for the Olympics these days must have provision for the majority of the contestants and spectators to arrive by mass transit.Invariably means a clean up at least, and usually a few new lines get built.
Can anyone thing of a recent Olympics that didnt have new rail built for it ?
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dowlingm
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Re: NYC Olympic Bid

Post by dowlingm » Sun Jun 01, 2014 8:31 am

I think it's unfortunate that politicians still believe that only if citizens agree to throw a massively expensive beano for a few weeks that they will be provided with transit investment - and I say that as someone who really enjoyed going to the Vancouver Olympics but numbers on Canada Line since show how badly needed the YVR-City link was needed whether the Olympics happened or not. This in turn creates artificial deadlines and consequent cost escalation because the contractors know the city can't fire them - as is undoubtedly going on in Brazil right now. In totally unconnected news: http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/tor ... e18840369/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Thomas
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Re: NYC Olympic Bid

Post by Thomas » Thu Jun 12, 2014 9:00 am

There is now some talk of moving the 2022 World Cup to the United States. If this were to occur, some games would be played at Metlife Stadium--and NJ Transit ridership would likely increase.

electricron
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Re: NYC Olympic Bid

Post by electricron » Thu Jun 12, 2014 9:03 am

Thomas wrote:There is now some talk of moving the 2022 World Cup to the United States. If this were to occur, some games would be played at Metlife Stadium--and NJ Transit ridership would likely increase.
.......i..............f..........
Let's discuss more about it once there's more certainly it's going to happen.

4400Washboard
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Re: NYC Olympic Bid

Post by 4400Washboard » Thu Jun 12, 2014 9:10 am

electricron wrote:
Thomas wrote:There is now some talk of moving the 2022 World Cup to the United States. If this were to occur, some games would be played at Metlife Stadium--and NJ Transit ridership would likely increase.
.......i..............f..........
Let's discuss more about it once there's more certainly it's going to happen.
I agree-this discussion is mainly educated guesses and discussions whether it will come to the USA in the first place (which i still think is unlikely). So, i propose we pin(??), but lock this thread so maybe in 2018 or whenever the olympics for 2020 and 2022 are released, we can make more accurate guesses based on the current postions of the transit agencies, their outloom thru the 2020 decade, location of venues, ppl interest/concentration, etc.
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dowlingm
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Re: NYC Olympic Bid

Post by dowlingm » Thu Jun 12, 2014 9:34 am

Thomas wrote:There is now some talk of moving the 2022 World Cup to the United States. If this were to occur, some games would be played at Metlife Stadium--and NJ Transit ridership would likely increase.
I imagine John Oliver's excoriation of FIFA last week went down like a lead balloon with whoever came up with that idea. That said, if the tournament would be held in already transit-served venues then the focus can be on incremental improvements which will endure beyond the tournament rather than wholly new stadia and transit lines to lie empty thereafter, as with so many WC and Olympic event venues around the world.

mtuandrew
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Re: NYC Olympic Bid

Post by mtuandrew » Tue Jun 17, 2014 11:37 am

tjensen wrote:I agree-this discussion is mainly educated guesses and discussions whether it will come to the USA in the first place (which i still think is unlikely). So, i propose we pin(??), but lock this thread so maybe in 2018 or whenever the olympics for 2020 and 2022 are released, we can make more accurate guesses based on the current postions of the transit agencies, their outloom thru the 2020 decade, location of venues, ppl interest/concentration, etc.
Thanks for the suggestion - I'll keep it under advisement. In the meantime, should developments come up about a major sporting event for the NYC area, we will keep the thread open.

Thomas
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Re: NYC Olympic Bid

Post by Thomas » Thu Jul 03, 2014 5:16 pm

A future FIFA World Cup, which would involve games being played in NJ, is becoming more and more likely...

http://www.cnbc.com/id/101758568#" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;.

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