Railroad Forums
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China is set to open a 2,298-km high-speed railway line, the world's longest, in about two weeks, linking the capital city with the country's trading hub of Guangzhou, authorities announced today.http://www.indianexpress.com/news/china ... e/1045400/
djlong wrote:Not hard to justify when you look at the thousands upon thousands of miles of HSR lines they built - all within the PAST FIVE YEARS.Sorry, but I can't agree. I see that Chinese HSR loses so much money that it can't repay even the principal of the loans extended to build those HSR lines.
trainmaster611 wrote:I don't think that financial self-sufficiency should be an end unto itself. ...[but] Don't build vanity lines whether it's HSR between Sacramento and Eugene or a subway out into the suburbs.Of course, financial self-sufficiency shouldn't be and end until itself. Amtrak certainly isn't self-sufficient. The issue is, "should HSR be built anywhere and everywhere, or should it be built only where it is able to attract some minimum amount of ridership and revenues (which don't need to cover all of its costs)?"
SouthernRailway wrote:I agree with you Southern. It seems like some of China's HSR lines are just built for the sake of being built and not in places where there can be a ridership to justify the costs. How many working class Chinese people can afford the high ticket prices? Not to mention we have no idea how safe China's HSR system is and how long it'll last.trainmaster611 wrote:I don't think that financial self-sufficiency should be an end unto itself. ...[but] Don't build vanity lines whether it's HSR between Sacramento and Eugene or a subway out into the suburbs.Of course, financial self-sufficiency shouldn't be and end until itself. Amtrak certainly isn't self-sufficient. The issue is, "should HSR be built anywhere and everywhere, or should it be built only where it is able to attract some minimum amount of ridership and revenues (which don't need to cover all of its costs)?"
In the US, we build passenger rail that's not self-sufficient, although passenger rail is generally built only where it can attract enough revenues to cover at least a decent portion of its costs, indicating that our passenger rail lines are built where there is enough ridership demand to make it worthwhile.
In China, the amounts being spent are so high, and the revenues being earned are so low, that I'd be tempted to put some Chinese HSR lines in the category of "vanity lines", like a subway to a distant suburb that doesn't really provide public benefits to make the projects worthwhile.
Would we build an Acela Express across Montana? No. Perhaps China would, though.
CComMack wrote:One major factor in China's HSR program is the relatively small commercial aviation infrastructure existing in China today, as compared to the US, or even Europe. China may very well not have the ability to scale its aviation sector up to handle its population; or, given their current safety record, may simply not wish to take the risks in doing so. At the very least, it may be just as astronomically expensive as building out HSR. (Of course, as demonstrated, their railway sector has safety issues of its own...)In 1991 I traveled domestically in China by both air and rail. The By air segment had me "Kissing the Ground" when I got off the plane. The Rail segment felt MUCH safer, and to boot it was STEAM !!! I don't know how it is now, but back then I swore I would NEVER AGAIN travel by air inside China!!!
At the beginning of the 21st century China had no high-speed railways.This CNN story likely does not break ground for those who follow China's rail affairs, but for the "rest of us", an eye opener.
Slow and often uncomfortable trains plodded across this vast country, with low average speeds making journeys such as Shanghai-Beijing a test of travel endurance.
Today, it's a completely different picture. The world's most populous nation has -- by some distance -- the world's largest network of high-speed railways.
No fewer than 37,900 kilometers (about 23,500 miles) of lines crisscross the country, linking all of its major mega-city clusters, and all have been completed since 2008.
Half of that total has been completed in the last five years alone, with a further 3,700 kilometers due to open in the coming months of 2021.
The network is expected to double in length again, to 70,000 kilometers, by 2035.
With maximum speeds of 350 kph (217 mph) on many lines, intercity travel has been transformed and the dominance of airlines has been broken on the busiest routes.
By 2020, 75% of Chinese cities with a population of 500,000 or more had a high-speed rail ink.
