New Adirondack Scenic Thread (ADIX)

[Jeff Smith]

Admin Note: As much as I wanted to let the previous discussion continue, it devolved into hints, allegations, and threats. Yes, hints of allegations of threats. I can't verify this stuff independently, so without making judgment I locked the thread and vaulted it. I'm not for one second going to get involved, deposed, or sued. PERIOD.

Rules for continued discussion:

1. The discussion should be related to the Operation of the Adirondack Scenic.
2. Developments concerning expansion, contraction, etc. and impact on operations (there's that word again) are welcome without the ad hominem stuff.
3. Controversies concerning trail advocate tactics, the local newspaper, the Governor, other politico's, etc. need to stay off the board. I can't verify this stuff. The back and forth has to stop over rail vs. trail. It's been argued to death. If there's a development to be reported, fine.

Comments that in the opinion of "management" that violate these three pretty simple rules will be subject to swift deletion and possible further action of warnings, suspensions, and bans.

There will be no LAST WORD as THIS is the last word. I want to add, I appreciate that topics such as these generate passion. I understand and even commiserate with some of the views expressed here. But a line was crossed, and it has no place here. So mind your P's and Q's, please. It's always a last resort when I have to restrict discussion, and I am not placing any blame here. What's done is done.

Let's move on to RAILROAD's. They're fun!

[ut-1]

Adirondack Scenic's 1835 leads its train southbound through Prospect 6:02 last night.

[Otto Vondrak]

So where's the old thread?

-otto-

[Jeff Smith]

Vaulted while I ruminate over its disposition.

[rhallock]

I was able to go on the Tupper Lake to Clear Lake Rail Explorers rai-bike trip on Sat. Aug. 27th. It was a great success. I was a bit concerned because 8:45am was approaching and no one had appeared, but soon everyone got there. We left TL on the rail-bikes about 9:30. Several stops were made enroute, including about 1 1/2 hours for lunch at a lake. This lake was about 1/4 mile from the track along an easy path. The lunch was packed in mason jars in a refrigerated bag and was good. This 17 mile piece of track was relatively level so not too tiring, with many lakes along the way to make it quite scenic. Bugs were not a problem at this time of year. I went on one of the guide's bikes (2 seats to each bike) and recommend that if possible since I could pass the time talking and sharing his knowledge, as well as his doing most of the pedal work so I could rest my arthritic knees. We got to Lake Clear about 3pm, and bus back to TL by about 3:45. Be advised that they cancel trips if the weather looks bad or if there aren't enough passengers to make the trip pay. I and another person had to postpone scheduled trips the previous weekend on short notice. It is strongly advised to make reservations on the phone rather than on the web site as the the info on it seems to be inaccurate. If you have any interest, do this now as the time is growing short.

[Matt Langworthy]

Good news! ADIX is getting a new repair facility.

http://www.timestelegram.com/news/20160 ... r-facility" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; reports:

The Adirondack Preservation Society received an award of $99,000 from the Community Foundation of Herkimer & Oneida Counties for the facility, a news release from the railroad group said.

That funding will supplement a $791,000 grant awarded by the New York State Department of Transportation and help the railroad leverage its matching funds obligation, the release said.

It will replace the old repair facility at Griffiss that shut down a few years back. ADIX should be able to repair 2 cars per year at the new facility, according to the article.

[thebigham]

http://www.northcountrypublicradio.org/ ... il-project" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

State press release

A stakeholder process to determine the design and operation of the recreational trail between Lake Placid and Tupper Lake on the Remsen to Lake Placid Travel Corridor has begun, New York State Department of Environmental Conservation (DEC) Regional Director Bob Stegemann announced today.

“We have convened the first meeting of our core stakeholder group to help us to determine what the trail will look like and how it will be operated,” said Director Stegemann. “We will use this process to ensure the creation of a recreational trail that will provide a high quality experience for trail users and a benefit to the communities along the trail. The trail will provide a broad variety of recreational opportunities for users of all abilities.”

The core stakeholder groups consist of the executive elected official or designee of the four towns and three villages along the trail, a representative from the Adirondack Recreational Trail Advocates and representatives from the three primary user groups – cross country skiers, bicyclist and snowmobilers.

"The town of North Elba is extremely pleased to see that the recreational trail is taking shape, said town of North Elba Supervisor Roby Politi. “North Elba is a primary stakeholder and it looks forward to working with DEC and the other partners to bring this project to fruition. Its construction will ultimately benefit the region and attract more outdoor enthusiast, athletes and visitors to the Adirondacks.”

“ARTA applauds DEC for creating a stakeholder group for constructing the recreational trail,” said Lee Keet of the Adirondack Recreational Trail Advocates.

“On behalf of the Board of the town of Tupper Lake, who previously passed resolutions in support of this project, and also on behalf of the over 100 businesses in Tupper Lake alone, who have signed on with their support, I am pleased to be a part of the stakeholder group developing the recreational trail,” said Patti Littlfield, Supervisor of the town of Tupper Lake. “I am excited to move forward with our regional neighbors toward a common goal of having the recreational trail completed in a timely manner to benefit all – economically and otherwise.”

"As the representative from the Village of Saranac Lake, I am proud to be part of the stakeholder effort to develop and maintain this world-class trail in the heart of the Adirondacks,” said Rich Shapiro, Saranac Lake Village Trustee. “Representatives from four towns, three villages, trail proponents, ORDA, and DEC are all working together in a public/private partnership. Great things are happening here in the Tri-Lakes.”

In addition to DEC officials, staff or officials from the Adirondack Park Agency, Olympic Regional Development Authority, and the Department of Transportation are members of the core stakeholder group.

The stakeholder group identified issues of concern which need addressing before the trail can become operational and other stakeholders who will participate in future meetings on specific issues. The issues identified to date include but are not limited to:

Type of Material used to surface the trail;

· Parking and trail access points;

· Trail amenities;

· Signage – interpretive and directional;

· Road crossings;

· Bridges;

· Illegal motor vehicle and motorized vehicle use;

· Train stations;

· Emergency response; and

· Historic preservation.

The stakeholder process will inform DEC’s development of a draft conceptual trail design and draft conceptual operations and maintenance plan which will be provided for public review and comment in the coming months. DEC will use the final conceptual trail design to develop a request for proposals to design and construct the trail. Rail removal and initial trail construction will begin in the summer of 2017.

If you believe you can help on one or more specific issues regarding the design or operation please contact the town supervisor or village mayor in the community you live.

If you believe you can help on one or more specific issues regarding the design or operation please contact the town supervisor or village mayor in the community you live.

[oibu]

NAUSEATING.

Where was the "stakeholder process" when the question of ripping out the railroad was first imagined by someone? But now, everyone and their dog is suddenly a "stakeholder" in yet another useless, duplicative trail that nobody but some locals with snowmobiles gives too poops about. Nobody uses these trails or ROWs other than that, yet time and again somebody falls for the line that it will be " "economic panacea" for the (------------- insert region name) area".

Hopefully in the end-game, Saranac will win big here and Placid will realize the error of their ways in due course.

[RussNelson]

I was able to go on the Tupper Lake to Clear Lake Rail Explorers rai-bike trip on Sat. Aug. 27th. It was a great success.

We did the week after, September 3rd. It was huge fun. Highly recommended.

[Tony Goodwin]

The decision to remove the rails from Tupper Lake to Lake Placid was arrived at after several years of input from each "stakeholder" group. This DEC committee should be an indication that we, ARTA and the DEC, do indeed intend to build a trail on the Corridor.

[oibu]

The freeloading lefties of Lake Placid can "intend" whatever they wish. But they ultimately must comply with the appropriate legal and regulatory obligations, unless Albany wishes to risk being taken to task in Federal court.

[rr503]

The town supervisor is an independent and the justice is a Republican.
So lay off Democrats. This has zero to do with party politics.
Also remember that this fight is one that will be one that is won with unity, not discord.

I have a real question though: is there any way that ADIX could sign up a summer only freight customer on the north end of the line so they can say that they have freight customer interest?
Also, this has definitely been answered before, but what is the rail weight on the line?

[oibu]

Calm down now- my comment didn't have much to do with the actual politicians, although certainly the party that I lean toward much of the time is also the one that IS in arrears in this particular case, at least at the State level. It has to do with the actual people who have ramrodded this issue just so they can have a free place to play while attempting to push legitimate business, and the established regulations governing the rail corridor within the Adirondack park, out the door.

If you asked them, most of these individuals I'd guess would probably self-identify as republican. But "communistic actions" speak louder than "rugged individualist" words.

Either way, the point still stands- just because Cuomo says "so", doesn't make it "so", without regard for laws and regulations, no matter how much the snowmobilers might wish it did. And just to clear, I don't have ANY problem with snowmobilers! (except in such cases as they don't play by the rules etc., but that goes for anyone else as well) But I do have a problem with anyone that tries to shut down a legitimate economic opportunity, and/ or co-opt public property for their own exclusive agenda to the exclusion of all others - totally regardless of their opinions or ownership/non-ownership of snowmobiles. (and lets please not let the bikers/hikers strawmen see the light of day ever again- it's been pretty well established that they aren't coming, because every time they are given an opportunity, they simply don't show up)

As far as unity, always remember that the discord is not from the railroad or pro-rail groups. The trail option has always been on the table! But the trail people seem not to be willing to play with others and are hell-bent on destroying infrastructure, bending regulations and laws, and shutting down economic incentives so they can gain exclusive use of these lands. Unity might be the solution, but how do you unify those who specifically chose to spit on the unity option from day one and instead try to force a "winner take all" outcome?

[RussNelson]

The decision to remove the rails from Tupper Lake to Lake Placid was arrived at after several years of input from each "stakeholder" group. This DEC committee should be an indication that we, ARTA and the DEC, do indeed intend to build a trail on the Corridor.

Except for the railroaders. And the railbikers. And the people who work for the railbike company. And the ATV riders currently riding on or next to the tracks. And all the ATV riders who aren't willing to ride on the tracks illegally.

Seems to me like a few stakes are missing.

Whatever happened to building a trail from Lake Clear Junction up to Malone? Oh, right, there are no tracks to destroy there.

[tree68]

The decision to remove the rails from Tupper Lake to Lake Placid was arrived at after several years of input from each "stakeholder" group. This DEC committee should be an indication that we, ARTA and the DEC, do indeed intend to build a trail on the Corridor.

DEC didn't even bother to sit in on the final hearings - they stood outside the room, chatting.

Literally tens of thousands of comments and signatures favoring the railroad have been ignored.

What we have here is a small group that wants everyone (even you, Tony, not to mention the snowmobilers) out of their woods.

As for the rail - most of it is 105 lb Dudley.