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  • National Docks Branch Improvments

  • Pertaining to all railroading subjects, past and present, in New Jersey
Pertaining to all railroading subjects, past and present, in New Jersey

Moderator: David

 #1480610  by CR7876
 
Effective 1201 Monday July 23rd, CP-LIBERTY at MP 3.1, CP-CHAPEL at MP 4.9, and a new controlled siding 9,500 feet in length will be placed in service on the National Docks Branch, enabling meets on the Branch as part of the ongoing Greenville Yard expansion.
 #1481309  by pumpers
 
Companies investing $$ is always a good thing. I'm a bit surprised to hear this (both the siding and Greenville Yd expansion) I admit, given all the general gloom and doom about RR traffic in NJ I usually hear. JS
 #1481346  by ccutler
 
Port Authority is paying for most of it. They are building another ship-to-rail container terminal there while improving the freightcar ferry service.
 #1481429  by rr503
 
pumpers wrote:Companies investing $$ is always a good thing. I'm a bit surprised to hear this (both the siding and Greenville Yd expansion) I admit, given all the general gloom and doom about RR traffic in NJ I usually hear. JS
The doom and gloom relates mostly to conventional traffic. Sure, some of that is justified, but there's a certain base of industry that, provided decent service, is bound both to NJ and to rail (chemicals, lumber yards, stone yards, any sort of warehouse that receives heavy products, etc).

I also think it's wrong to rag on unconventional freight. IM, trash and the like have been the growth engine for NJ rail traffic over the last few decades, and in all likelihood will continue to be -- especially as PANAMAX expansion's and ship rerouting's effects are felt on container volumes at PANYNJ.
 #1481644  by pumpers
 
rr503 wrote: The doom and gloom relates mostly to conventional traffic. Sure, some of that is justified, but there's a certain base of industry that, provided decent service, is bound both to NJ and to rail (chemicals, lumber yards, stone yards, any sort of warehouse that receives heavy products, etc).

I also think it's wrong to rag on unconventional freight. IM, trash and the like have been the growth engine for NJ rail traffic over the last few decades, and in all likelihood will continue to be -- especially as PANAMAX expansion's and ship rerouting's effects are felt on container volumes at PANYNJ.
I hope my post wasn't misinterpreted. Far be it from me to rag on new sources of traffic. The world changes, you have to adapt. If we were still relying on anthracite to support NJ railroads, then we would really be in trouble.
 #1481658  by rr503
 
pumpers wrote:
rr503 wrote: The doom and gloom relates mostly to conventional traffic. Sure, some of that is justified, but there's a certain base of industry that, provided decent service, is bound both to NJ and to rail (chemicals, lumber yards, stone yards, any sort of warehouse that receives heavy products, etc).

I also think it's wrong to rag on unconventional freight. IM, trash and the like have been the growth engine for NJ rail traffic over the last few decades, and in all likelihood will continue to be -- especially as PANAMAX expansion's and ship rerouting's effects are felt on container volumes at PANYNJ.
I hope my post wasn't misinterpreted. Far be it from me to rag on new sources of traffic. The world changes, you have to adapt. If we were still relying on anthracite to support NJ railroads, then we would really be in trouble.
Oh no misinterpretation! My apologies! I simply wished to respond to those opinions you alluded to.
 #1483055  by rr503
 
Tangentially related, but it seems the new ExpressRail facility in Greenville will open sometime towards the end of this year. See bottom of this press release:

http://www.panynj.gov/press-room/press- ... ne_id=2970" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Should be interesting to see what (if any) trains are created/where they go. The international IM landscape has changed dramatically over the past year or so.
 #1483083  by R&DB
 
rr503 » Wed Aug 15, 2018 11:00 pm
Should be interesting to see what (if any) trains are created/where they go.
I wonder if the majority of the new traffic from the Greeneville/National Docks/ExpressRail will be routed through Croxton or Oak Island.
Last edited by R&DB on Thu Aug 16, 2018 6:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 #1483094  by rr503
 
R&DB wrote:
rr503 » Wed Aug 15, 2018 11:00 pm
Should be interesting to see what (if any) trains are created/where they go.
I wonder if the majority of the new traffic from the Greeneville/National Docks/ExpressRail will routed through Croxton or Oak Island.
Just spitballing here, but I'd assume that's gonna depend on the railroad -- CSX will send trains up to North Bergen/River Line, NS to OI and then Lehigh. That said, there's always the possibility the new terminal won't generate enough traffic to justify its own train(s), in which case I'd assume NS would route containers to Croxton for combination with other IM runs.
 #1483375  by SecaucusJunction
 
NS combines some of the traffic with Erail trains since it’s right next door. Right now, they don’t really run the National Docks at all except to occasionally shuffle cars around. The only reason they ever would run there is if they decided to run traffic north to Binghamton and Buffalo via Port Jervis as has long been rumored but never happened.
 #1483453  by pumpers
 
SecaucusJunction wrote:NS combines some of the traffic with Erail trains since it’s right next door. Right now, they don’t really run the National Docks at all except to occasionally shuffle cars around. The only reason they ever would run there is if they decided to run traffic north to Binghamton and Buffalo via Port Jervis as has long been rumored but never happened.
So all the traffic heading west from Coxton on the Lehigh line (or in the other direction) goes via the P&H?
 #1483468  by rr503
 
pumpers wrote:
SecaucusJunction wrote:NS combines some of the traffic with Erail trains since it’s right next door. Right now, they don’t really run the National Docks at all except to occasionally shuffle cars around. The only reason they ever would run there is if they decided to run traffic north to Binghamton and Buffalo via Port Jervis as has long been rumored but never happened.
So all the traffic heading west from Coxton on the Lehigh line (or in the other direction) goes via the P&H?
Yes. Really the only traffic that uses the ND today is stuff that has to — moves to Bayonne and Greenville, and runs from the north to Oak Island or points along the Chemical Coast (and their equivalents in the other direction). Otherwise, it’s an unnecessarily slow jughandle east on a largely single track line.
 #1483499  by SecaucusJunction
 
The amount of traffic on the line is actually pretty significant. I believe most of the CSX gen freights make stops at OI. All of the CSX port container traffic, autorack traffic and ethanol traffic take the route.
 #1496227  by rr503
 
Per Trains News Wire, the new IM facility at Greenville is open. It seems NS has added some shuttles from Harrisburg to serve it (elsewhere it was said symbols were 242 and 243). Anything on the CSX side?

Edit: downloaded the public NS IM schedules, and there are indeed references to trains 242/243 going to/from "null, NJ." I take it this is Greenville, but it has yet to be programmed into the NS system. Trains seem to run M/W/F in both directions.
 #1496233  by CR7876
 
rr503 wrote:Per Trains News Wire, the new IM facility at Greenville is open. It seems NS has added some shuttles from Harrisburg to serve it (elsewhere it was said symbols were 242 and 243). Anything on the CSX side?

Edit: downloaded the public NS IM schedules, and there are indeed references to trains 242/243 going to/from "null, NJ." I take it this is Greenville, but it has yet to be programmed into the NS system. Trains seem to run M/W/F in both directions.
242 will run Su/Tu/Th from HBG, carry NYCT and GCT.
243 will run M/W/F departing Erail for HBG